Is LECA Okay For Growing Outdoorsn in FL ?

[NewBloom]

I'm considering using LECA to replace the moss/bark mix my rescue Phals are potted in. Will not be using the LECA for S/H.

The phals came to me in bad shape in March. They'd seen it all: over/under watering, too much/too little light and not enough air, some were very close to rot. I repotted them then watched and waited while they adapted to a shaded area outside. Fast forward two months and there are new leaves coming up and new roots showing. But...

Summer weather is here.

The humidity has been climbing to 80% and it's rained several days in a week. It's early in the season and it will only get more intense. (The summer pattern in the Tampa Bay area is upper 80s to low 90s days and frequent rainstorms). I'm thinking the moss is holding too much moisture for these phals to handle. Two have fallen behind. I checked their roots and they have been compromised, so I put them into a fresh drier mix and have them in a protected area where they won't be exposed to rain. The area is too small for me to move over all my orchids so I'm worried how the other ones will fare as summer continues.

I'm looking for freedback from folks who use LECA merely as a medium, not for s/h. Will LECA be a better alternative for moisture control for orchids exposed to regular rain?

I see different brands mentioned like Hydroton, PrimeAgra and Allifor. What would be most suitable for FL?

Would LECA be less appealing for bugs?

[Ray]

Many Florida growers use LECA as a standard medium, precisely because it never decomposes, and even when it is saturated, it remains airy for the root system. While it is not an insect deterrent, it is less-hospitable for them than organic-based media.

Even though I have a vested interest in PrimeAgra, for your conditions and specific application, its advantages over other brands would not have any particular value, so go with what is most available.

[maria1971]

Hi there.


I live in Miami and I use 100% LECA as a medium, and not s/h. I use it on Catt alliance plants: Laelias, rupicolous Laelias, Cattleyas, Epidendrums. I also use it on Renantheras, and I use fine grade hydroton on my seedlings.

However, I do NOT use it on phals. Probably because I do not leave my phalaenopsis outside. I have found that leaving a phal outside in my weather is tantamount to inciting an feeding frenzy for bugs--I just don't think Phals do well exposed to the elements as do Catt Alliance and Vandas in my conditions.

As a side note, I bought Martin Motes' book on growing in Florida, and it's quite helpful. He suggests (and I have found his suggestions to be on point) to give your plants a hard dry. I do this every summer and have yet to lose a plant to rot following his advice. I put all my plants inside my covered terrace, let them sit there for a week without watering at all. At the end of the week, I fertilize, then give them another one to two weeks to be bone dry. THEN I put them outside. But, I do this periodically during the heavy rains. Even in LECA, it just rains too much to leave the plants out there getting rained on every day.

However, I don't think your phals will do well with a hard dry. This is what I do for those specific genera.

I also increase my thiomyl use to once per month--I drench the plants.

Good luck--I really suggest either you buy Motes' book or subscribe to his newsletter. His advice is wonderful.

[rcb]

I live on the coast in the panhandle. I've switched most of my plants over to LECA, and love it. But I don't grow Phals.

[Shannara]

I use aliflor and stalite and both are very dry "kiln fired" type mixes. The LECA is similiar and you could consider adding some charcoal to the mix too. Most of my plants are encyclia and catt types though. I have not tried using a dry mix on Phal's but wouldn't hesitate to try it if my plants were staying too wet. My plants are getting rained on everyday now and there is no way anything but a super dry mix could work for me and keep the root rot away.

I say try it on at least one plant and see how it goes. If it responds well you could pot up more in LECA.

HTH

Shann~

[Stitz]

Experiment! Try 'em all.

Growing orchids is your hobby, yes?

Have some fun with it! Share your results.

[E-Jag]

I grow all but a couple of my orchids outside in Hydroton (not s/h). This includes maybe a dozen phals. I love the stuff, would never go back to bark. I've had no problems but I suspect the heat shortens the blooming cycle of the phals. A half dozen or so have been in bloom since February but they're fading now. I noticed today, though, that two of my dens are throwing up spikes. The catts have a lot of new growth. I water more often - a lot more often - because I don't have to worry about bark rotting and suffocating roots. LECA provides lots of air/air pockets around the roots, nearly can't overwater. I fertilize at least twice a week. I've had no problems at all. It really simplifies growing FOR ME. Since it doesn't break down, I don't repot unless the plant outgrows the container and, when I do repot, I can re-use the LECA. I would suggest you give it a try with a couple of plants. I can't imagine you'd go back to bark or sphag. Do a search here, you'll find a lot of threads/information on this method of growing in LECA. Good luck.

[NewBloom]

E-Jag,

What is your watering regimen during the summer when the rainfall kicks in? And how do you know when it's time to water when using LECA? Can you tell by looking or by touch? And what type of pots are you using?

Is fertilizer or salt build up a concern when using this method?


Thank you all for your feedback. I'm off to research vendors with reasonable shipping costs.

[E-Jag]

NewBloom, my orchids are on a covered front/side porch so rain isn't an issue. With the 90/91/92 degree heat, I water every other day by sitting them in individual containers of water for about 10 minutes or so. I add water to the containers until the LECA begins to float. When I lift the plant out, water rushes through the containers and out so they're always flushed. Some are in wooden baskets but it works the same. In what I laughingly call winter (except for the last one) I water a little less but not much. Later this summer I may water a few of the water hogs every day, but not the phals. Don't know where in Florida you live but I can buy Hydroton locally. Check yellow pages or hits the plant/orchid shows.

[jerrymeola]

I have grown most everything at some time or other in Leca products. There is not much difference in brands. In Florida you will find AliFlor (cheapest) and Hydrothron readily. Hydrothron is very round while AliFlor is irregular. Both work well but hydrothron is prettier. Remember they must be fertilized regularily or they will slowly deteriorate in Leca. Salt buildup is not a problem as the rains in Florida will flush it almost every day in the summer.

Phals do exceptionally good in leca especially if used with a saucer as true semi-hydroponics. Phals do not like to dry out and one day can dry a plant heavily in Florida summer heat. Even with a saucer the saucer will dry every day.

For those who do not want to go to leca and still grow outdoors in Florida try increasing the amount of charcoal in the bark mix. I use 50% bark and 50% charcoal. All the orchids can take 3-4 waterings a week as the charcoal does not retain much water.

There is one big disadvantage with leca in that the plants are very unstable in the pot for the first year. My customers who had small children or pets did not like it as the plants were constantly being knocked out of the pots. This may not be a problem for you. If they get bumped often the roots bruise and the plants will do poorly, so before you use it be certain the plants can stay undisturbed.

[NewBloom]

Thanks for the phal tips, Jerry. E-jag, I live in Tampa too. Where did you buy the Hydroton?

[Shannara]

I have both Hydroton round pellets and the irregular aliflor and I personally like the aliflor better because of its irregular shapes and sizes. I find it a little easier to pot with and my plants roots cling to it very well. The smooth rounded Hydroton tends to fall out of the pot easily and is a little harder to manage. I would recommend you looking into stalite also. It is very porous and the grey color looks very attractive against the green foliage of my plants.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

Shann~

[E-Jag]

NewBloom, I get Hydroton at Worms Way, 4402 N 56th Street (621-1792). They have it in a couple different size bags - I get a 10 liter bag for $10.50. The store is fairly close to USF so I stop in there when I go to a plant/orchid show at the Botannical Gardens. There are numerous hydroponic type stores in Tampa so you might find one closer to you. I have only a couple dozen or so orchids so a bag lasts me quite a while.

[NewBloom]

I stopped by Grace's Hydro Organic Garden Center, which on the opposite end of N. 56th, and got a 5L bag for $6.75. I've got four phals that I'll repot into the Hydroton and see how it goes.

I'll check out Worm's Way in the future. Thanks again for all the info.

[tinabee]

I notice with one of my phals in hydroton that the roots on the inside were nice and firm, but instead of being green, they were absorbing some of the clay color from the pebbles so that they were no longer green. I take it this is normal and nothing to worry over? FWI, I soaked the media for almost a week before using and changed the water each day.

I have phals in my screened-in East facing porch pretty much all in hydroton. Some are planted in the two stage S/H pots, the rest are in clear pots. I use the skewer method to double check for moisture levels, and I find right now with the humidity I am watering every other day.

[NancyG]

I use Leca for my phals with some shag in s/h containers and in clay. They are outside unless in bloom then I bring them indoors. The phals get some morning light except Naples Night which seems to be able to take more. They all bloom regularly for me. My phals mounted to palms do well also.

I'm interrested in the hard dry method Maria uses. Do you do this even to the vandas? I get Martin Motes newsletters and they are beneficial. Even though I have my dens and catts under the covered terrace they still get showered on with the rains we have been having lately.

One summer I left my plants in leca out in filtered light when we went on vacation. I came home to some that just rotted. Even with leca the Florida rain was too much for them. This year I'm bringing them inside.

[NewBloom]

Wow, Tina. I'm impressed with your patience. Here I thought my twenty hour Hydroton soak was good. I thought with the higher humidity, the s/h method would offer you more days between waterings.

Nancy, your sphag/leca technique is one I hadn't read before. I thought shag and s/h didn't mix. Are you using the azalea pots and closing the bottom hole?

[tinabee]

Air gets to the roots much easier with LECA. Because of that, I have to water more often. With the clear pots, it is much easier to see what is going on. So far, so good.....only time will tell, though. On one of my Baldan's Kaleidoscopes, I can see new roots growing right down into the media.

If worse comes to worse, I'll replace any plants I may lose and get the S/H two staged pots w/water gauge. The phals I have in that, including my two mini-phals are doing really well with it.

[maria1971]

Originally Posted by NancyG

I use Leca for my phals with some shag in s/h containers and in clay. They are outside unless in bloom then I bring them indoors. The phals get some morning light except Naples Night which seems to be able to take more. They all bloom regularly for me. My phals mounted to palms do well also.

I'm interrested in the hard dry method Maria uses. Do you do this even to the vandas? I get Martin Motes newsletters and they are beneficial. Even though I have my dens and catts under the covered terrace they still get showered on with the rains we have been having lately.

One summer I left my plants in leca out in filtered light when we went on vacation. I came home to some that just rotted. Even with leca the Florida rain was too much for them. This year I'm bringing them inside.

Hi there!!! I don't have any vandas. (not any more)

Motes indicates in his book that the heavy rains eventually serve to leach out nutrients from the plants (i.e. it rains too much) so at some point he says to give your orchids a hard dry (he didn't exclude vandas though). He also noted that IF one is to water during the heavy rains, it should ONLY be to fertilize---and fertilize heavily. So, that's what I've been doing.

My Laelias and LCs have been inside my terrace now for two weeks. I did a rotation. I left the rupicolous laelias and the seedlings outside and only brought in the big ones. The big pots got fertilized twice during the two week period. At the start of the week, I noticed that there's still condensation in the pots. If there's still condensation by Saturday, I'll leave them inside and wait another week. If not, I'm going to fertilize them again and maybe leave them inside for another week.

The rupicolous laelias and seedlings started their rotation last week--but since they are smaller pots, they take less time to dry out. I'm planning on fertilizing the rupics one more time and then letting them dry out completely. The seedlings I need to watch bcs they are still babies.

I repeat this during the winter...I usually it is easier bcs it's not raining.

It seems the plants love it though-----I noticed sheaths inside the new growths. And, there's absolutely no sign of bugs, rot or any problems.

[NancyG]

I'm going to try the hard dry while I'm away on vacation. 12 days without water and you think they will be okay?

[maria1971]

Originally Posted by NancyG

I'm going to try the hard dry while I'm away on vacation. 12 days without water and you think they will be okay?

I wouldn't try to go 12 days without watering vandas.


Ummmmm are they wet now? If not, before leaving I would fertilize everyone.

I've done this with catt alliance only, so keep that in mind.

[NancyH]

Hi, I live in Central CA and my orchids are in a greenhouse. I have been having a problem with rot. Even plants I re-potted last year had some root rot and white mold in the pots. I use cork, charcoal, bark and pumice. I do watch how I water, I must tend to over water. I just re-potted all my Catts, LC's BLc's ect in pure leca with a little spag on the top to help preserve a little moisture. Some I planted in clear pots. I am curious as to how they will all do. I do have a misting system that helps a bit with the moisture, but it does not get down into the pots. This is an experiment for me as I read about leca on this site. I noticed all you folks that have turned to leca live in Florida and have to deal with much rain and moisture. I will keep you posted as to how my plants are doing. I have probably re-potted 40 plants to pure leca. It will be interesting!

[NewBloom]

NancyH,

Welcome! I'm by no means an expert, but I'm wondering if your plants were getting enough air circulation in the greenhouse. All the best on your transition to LECA. Take pictures and keep us posted.

[Brooke]

NancyH I use Prime Agra and clay pots for most of my catt family and they do great. I have to water the PA pots approximately twice as often as the ones still in bark but roots are rampant in the pellets. Eventually all my catt family will be switched out of bark.

I also grow in a g/h.

Brooke

[NancyH]

Thanks Brook,
I don't know what clay agra is. Sounds like the leca. I will keep you posted. I did buy a digital moisture meter, but is does not work very well in a drier soil. It does register if I plunge it into water, but not well in a wet soil. I am going to exchange it today for another type. I want to monitor what's going on for my own curiousity. I will keep yoou all posted. Nancy

[NancyH]

Newbloom,Forget to let you know I do have a fan running all the time and these days the door and vent stays open. Maybe its the bark....who knows. Yhanks, Nancy