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Old 06-30-2007, 11:10 AM
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alternative pesticides

I wonder if anyone has used natural 'plant' pesticides instead of chemicals in the garden, especially with orchids.

I did a little bit of research and found that these plants can be grown to ward off insects and pests. I am not sure if they will be effective on microbes as whole plants.

Garlic - Allium sativum

Basil - Ocimum basilicum

Ginger - Zingiber officinale

Chrysanthemum spp.

Castor - Ricinus communis

Coleus spp. - especially Coleus forskohlii

I think Gladys47 has a castor plant in her garden.

Any thoughts on their use?

I intend to plant them in pots and interspersing them with the orchids. The problem is to find the growable cloves and roots.

I hope I am not going to be laughed at for thinking a bit tangently!!
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Old 06-30-2007, 11:20 AM
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I think it is definitely worth a try. Good idea, I may put some of my Basil in with mine.
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Old 06-30-2007, 12:22 PM
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pikevi - I think that is an awesome idea! I wonder how they would do in my atrium. Certainly worth a try!
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Old 06-30-2007, 12:30 PM
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pikevi: I'm certainly no expert with this topic, however, I know that garlic is being used a lot for pesticide, but usually in a spray form. Not sure what the garlic plant itself would ward off.

Castor plants are dangerous - particularly to curious children & animals. Personally, I'd steer clear of this one.
http://www.ansci.cornell.edu/plants/...html#ricinpois

Pyrethrum is extracted from chrysanthemum petals and widely used in many non-toxic garden spays. i.e. Safer7, but I'm not sure what effect the entire growing plant would have, since it is the dried pressed petals used for the pesticide. Interesting question though. Please let us know your findings.
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Old 06-30-2007, 12:32 PM
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Gee, neem oil is as natural as those, and how about pyrethrin from marigolds. Neem is a tree. Maybe you could plant one and put your plants under it for shade, and surround the outside edge with marigolds. I think some of these ideas may be OK for out door growing where there is the possibility of a natural balance.

For me, in a greenhouse(GH), and for those growing in a home, one bug is a disaster about to happen, so I use effective pesticides aggressively, and I recommend the same for the indoor growers.

My mite problem has shown up again, but with constant vigilance, I caught it in a very early stage, and since I have marked all the plants known to be liked by the spider mites, it was an easy job to assess the size and location of the infection, and again treat only the infected or likely to be infected plants with neem oil. This time, I mix one of the systemic fungicides in with the neem for many of the plants, and am hoping this won't be one of those bad combinations. I will be retreating all sprayed plants with systemic fungicides over the next 2 or 3 weeks as I have seen what I think is stress in some orchids from the neem. I think I am getting the mites from the bushes outside my GH. The plants I have on a shelf against the outside of my GH, with the GH's shadecloth over the plants, only had miner amounts of mites on the plants at the ends of the shelf/shade cloth/greenhouse, where they are closest to the bushes.
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Old 06-30-2007, 01:44 PM
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My huge basil and pepper bushes were reduced to only a handful from black scales last month..but it's making come back since, and looking much healthier now. At least I know basil doesn't work on scales, but I wll try it on mealies and aphids and will see how it works. I don't use chemical pesticides of any kind on the herbs and veggies, so this is good news...thanks Pikevi.
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Old 07-01-2007, 08:29 AM
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Thanks, Cynthia.

I use neem oil and safers soap on my plants, especially orchids.

So far I have not had any major problems with any of my plants.

I do have a neem plant(tree?) which is doing OK. It is already about 2 metres (7') high.

It may become a huge tree.

Yes, Sharyn. Ricin is very potent but it is found only in seeds, I believe. But castor oil is used medicinally as a purgative all over the world ( but I have serious reservations about its use)

I will try the innocent ones like coleus,ginger and garlic first.

Attached is the photo of the neem tree that I have.
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Old 07-03-2007, 10:55 PM
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I found this neat article on "companion planting" which is what Pikevi suggested. I'm not sure how it may be applied to orchid growing. http://www.gardening.cornell.edu/fac.../complant.html
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Old 07-04-2007, 09:29 PM
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Thanks gerneveyn.

It may or may not apply to orchid growing but very informative.

I think many large scale farmers still use crop rotation for increasing nitrogen levels in the soil (Biological Nitrogen Fixation-BNF). Some use certain plants,mainly wild weeds, I think, in organic farming to help ward off insects.
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Old 07-05-2007, 09:12 AM
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I don't know if it will help but I found something at a salvage grocery that looks promising. Its called Anti Pest O. It says its a repellent for plants. It also says its organic and "safe". It was really cheap so I am going to go back and get the rest of what they have. I think it was 15 more bottles.

I can't send all the bugs to their demise so I will just send them packing to somewhere else. It does not smell good by any stretch of the imagination as its made with habanero peppers, garlic, and Azadirachtin. Azadirachtin is the natural active ingredient found in the seeds of India's neem tree. Since it repels the critters it appears that it might be safer than most of the other preps on the market.

The main bug problem I have is grasshoppers and katydid eating the leaves of my Plumeria trees. This stuff says it doesn't make bees sick or send them packing so I will still have my pollinators.

Here is a link from the tree library on this stuff. Does anyone see anything that could potentially harm my orchids?

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Anti-P...ly-a0131008902

Last edited by zonepusher; 07-05-2007 at 09:15 AM. Reason: Hit submit before I was finished.
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Old 07-05-2007, 11:50 AM
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I found the neem to be stressful for some orchids. Normally neem should be applied while it is cool and out of direct sun. Don't know about the extract tho. So maybe just to be safe, do it very late or very early in the day (if you are a very early riser, which I am not).
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Old 07-05-2007, 12:39 PM
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I work nights so early is when I get off LOL I usually take care of my plants before I go to bed. This is the ONLY good thing about working nights.

So far it appears that the hoppers do not like the stuff. I have not seen a single one on my other plants. I haven't used it on the orchids yet as I figured the stress of the move was enough for a little bit, not to mention the ones that have been repotted.
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Old 07-05-2007, 12:56 PM
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I have a 'natural' product (scary term, because not all things natural are good for us or our plants) that has worked very well for me. It is called Flower Pharm and is effective against pests, bacteria and fungus. They have many formulas directed at various problems and it has nothing in it to harm my indoor cats or my asthma. Common ingredients are cinnamon, garlic, cottonseed oil, rosemary, to name a few. I found it at an upscale nursery, a relative bargain at $20 for one liter premixed. I find neem to be a bit of a pain to apply and with my small collection I love this ready-to-go stuff. Also online at www.pharmsolutions.com
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Old 07-05-2007, 05:00 PM
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Hey, PhalPal! I, too, use Pharm Solutions. However, I found it while searching for 'natural' pesticide, since I still have a small child living at home. I use the Indoor Pharm solution, which works on mealies and scales. So far, I think it's working of spider mites. I sprayed a couple plants that had them and noticed they're gone.

Btw, I also use Garlic Pharm to keep the neighbors' cats away. It helps keep my yard from being used as potty central.
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Old 07-05-2007, 05:14 PM
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arlene - I really love this stuff since I have lots of cats running around and ya never know when they might take a bite out of something. (they haven't yet) I wonder if the garlic formula will help some of the members with their squirrel problems????? Hmmmmmm.
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Old 07-05-2007, 06:06 PM
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Smile Organic spray site

Hey Phalpal,
Thanks for the organic spray site. It looks real good. I am a Master Gardener and we are always looking for organic products to control pests. The planting of certain plants to control critters is called IPM, or Intergrated Pest Management. It makes use of various plants and organic solutions to control unwanted pests & plants(weeds) in your garden. We should all be carefull not to kill the good critters that are out there. Its harder to use organics in a greenhouse situation but those of us that have small collections can certainly use less caustic measures in all of the garden. I don't spray my roses anymore and have never sprayed my orchids. (lucky uh). The roses get a little PM(powdery mildew), black spot, or rust but if its not bad I just live with it until a heat wave comes along (like the last few days) & all of it gets killed and the new growth comes out clean. Guess I have rambled on long enough.
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Old 07-05-2007, 06:51 PM
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Hummer- I am reluctant to spray outside also. I am lucky to have some resident opossoms that keep the snails controlled completely. I do have a few nibbles on my roses, but that is because I have a really cool praying mantis living among my roses. Wouldn't spray him!!! But then again, everything turns in to a PET for me.
Something else I like about the Pharm Solutions is it is a great leaf shiner with added benefits. I was never too crazy about the silicone based products on leaves; seems it would inhibit the plants natural processes. Since my orchids are in my dining room, does not seem practical to have marigolds among them!
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Old 07-07-2007, 09:21 PM
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I found some ginger with new growth coming off the rhizomes.

I will plant them in small pots and keep them amongst orchids.

Whether they are effective or not , I assume they will not hurt the orchids.

I will hunt for sprouting garlic next!
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Old 07-07-2007, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikevi View Post
I found some ginger with new growth coming off the rhizomes.

I will plant them in small pots and keep them amongst orchids.

Whether they are effective or not , I assume they will not hurt the orchids.

I will hunt for sprouting garlic next!
Will they not rob water and nutrients from the orchids? Not to mention intertwining with the roots. Might be a bear come repot time.
Andi
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Old 07-08-2007, 08:49 AM
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I think planting them with orchids may not be good idea nor would it be viable solution. In any case garlic and ginger would need soil.

I planned to plant them in small pots but my mom put a dent in that idea. Ginger will form rhizomes and hence would require room in the pot which will be a premium in small pots. I am looking for ideas how best to go about it.

For me space in between orchids is a problem so I have to strike a balance between the size of the pot and the well being of ginger .
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Old 07-08-2007, 12:27 PM
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Plants growing in orchid pots could represent a serious problem, especially for ferns that have very tough and extensive root systems. When you go to repot, it is impossible to get the bark out becuause the fern roots hold it together, and you have to do a lot of damage to orchid roots getting the old mix and fern roots out.
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Old 07-08-2007, 05:10 PM
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Thanks Cynthia.

I had no intention of planting ferns in the same pots as orchids. I just wondered if separately potted ferns can be placed inside the tank just to augment the beauty of the terrarium.

I will scrap the idea for now.
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Old 07-09-2007, 03:51 AM
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Neem Tree Oil

I bought a quart of neem tree oil about 6 months ago and have been using it on the orchids and on my fern/hosta shade bed in the yard. I still have to use snail bait, but the neem oil seems to be doing the trick for other bugs. Anything that bites the plant is supposed to have it's reproductive cycle messed up and die. So far, so good. The oil is a bit pricey, about $30 for the quart. But you only use an ounce per gallon. I mix it, dawn dishwashing detergent as a surfactant and the "special formula" for orchids I bought over the net. It is a mix of epson salt, beer and ammonia. Chemically it sounds right and I go by the feed a little once a week while growing. The orchids seem to like this regimen.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:22 AM
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Carnivorous plants are my weapon of choice

Nepenthes grow in near exact conditions to orchids, check out their culture, its very very similiar. A few highland nepenthes live with my collection, one is making pitchers around 15-20cm long, the others are smaller with 3cm pitchers. These are great in the greenhouse on a sunny day, buzzing sounds are often heard from their deadly traps They have no dormancy period, growing all year. They must have rainwater, and only very light fertiliser, but good insect supplie is much better.

If you dont want so much hassle, sarrencenia are just as good, probably better, depending on where you live. they like it very sunny, full sun all day, and are quite happy in hot temperatures as long as there kept sitting in rainwater. They do go through a dormancy period in winter though, which keeping them cool could be hard for some of you in hot climates. These plants originate from the USA though so i suggest you guys give them a whirl as they are cheap to buy and very easy to grow.

There are other varieties of course, but for pure insect catching these two are seen as the most effective. Drosera and pinguicula are good for those with small insects like gnats.
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Old 07-09-2007, 02:03 PM
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For gnats, the best thing by far is the mosquito dunks sold at home centers. Add a bit of it to your watering can or RO holding tank. It has a living organism in it that feeds on the gnat larvae. Totally safe and very effective. No gnats anywhere after its use.
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