Novice To Try S/H???

[vcuchick]

I'm very curious about the S&H method of growing orchids...I have an extremely dry climate in my office and my onc.; Den.; and Phals are in active growth, but the watering is crazy...

where can I buy the materials for this? Any ideas? Online sites recommended?

I think I'd like to try my Onc. first since they seem to have the shriveled pseudobulbs....

[janet_a]

at the risk of advertising...


Welcome to First Rays Orchids


(the starter kit is fab... )

[LouisW]

S/H sounds perfect for you! Watering couldn't be easier, just make sure it has a full reservoir... and thats all. The roots will have all the water they need all the time and almost no risk of rot (if you do it right).

I Recommend you don't begin until you have read the First Rays Orchids website explanation of S/H and Jays tutorial thread on this forum. It is sticky under the Hydroponic/semi-hydroponic culture portion of this forum. That should give you a good understanding of this method.

S/H pots can be made out of many things, and good LECA (light expanded clay aggregate-the little clay balls) can be bought for fairly cheep at any Hydroponic store. Plastic containers shaped like plant pots are very easy to convert into a S/H pot. Just drill a hole in the right spot and your set to go.

Study up (its fairly simple) and give it a try!

[PhalPal]

Ecogrow Hydroponic Supplies your best source for Hydroponics Supplies and Nutrients has the stuff you would need as well, but shipping costs can be prohibitive for some. A lot depends on how your tap water too; some of us can just use our local water and some of us can't.

Jay has a good thread out right now with pictures of an Oncidium he put in S/H two years ago. It goes from failing to flourishing living in the desert - talk about dry!

Heres the thread: 2 years in S/H and what a turn around!

[Plucky Purcell]

If you don't have any hydroponic stores nearby, the best spot is probably online.

I also have a thread going about my Onc. Sharry Baby that I put in S/H. Note that everything I know I learned from Jay and Ray. Those guy's kick some serious butt!

[jay]

For supplies I would look in the Yellow Pages under hydroponic. Most major cities have Hydroponic stores somewhere. Otherwise it looks like you have many links here already of where to find supplies.

If you do this in an office, make sure you set up a small fan for them. Airflow, Airflow, Airflow.

[vcuchick]

I already have a small fan I got at Target...gives good airflow. I'm so exceited. now if only I could get the step-by-step photos...hahahaha

[exasperatus2002]

ONe of our members Jerry sells them too.

OrchidsAmore Home page

[LouisW]

Originally Posted by vcuchick

I'm so exceited. now if only I could get the step-by-step photos...

You already have them you just need to go look at them. There are step by step photos on Jays thread, and on First Ray Orchids website. I encourage you to read them both. Plus there are photos of plants that have had success that should get you pumped.

[oncidiumlover]

Now I'm going to let you experiment for me! Please keep me updated on your s/h venture, my sharry baby isn't looking so good, if this works well for you, maybe I'll have to try it. lol.

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by LouisW

You already have them you just need to go look at them. There are step by step photos on Jays thread, and on First Ray Orchids website. I encourage you to read them both. Plus there are photos of plants that have had success that should get you pumped.

doh! I knew that, thanks!

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by oncidiumlover

Now I'm going to let you experiment for me! Please keep me updated on your s/h venture, my sharry baby isn't looking so good, if this works well for you, maybe I'll have to try it. lol.

how's the worm tea? hahaha

[NancyG]

I got all my supplies from First Rays and the containers are really nice. You can substitute containers with deli, etc and drill two holes about 1 inch from bottom on one side. I just put a couple more in s/h and repotted some that were in s/h recently. Since I'm in S Florida and very humid 6 months of the year the roots grew down into the reservoir and rotted at the tips. I just snipped those away. I'm using orchid clay pots from Home Depot too. Hoping to eleviate the rot problem.

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by janet_a

at the risk of advertising...


Welcome to First Rays Orchids


(the starter kit is fab... )

Janet,

I highly agree, I was going to buy a couple starter kits for my plants, but after email conversations with Ray, he told me what to buy and it turned out to be MUCH cheeper than originally believed... yaa!

I've ordered my supplies, I'll post pictures of the process once I get my stuff in...weee! (so excitied!!!)

[kazjak]

I use a soldering iron to make my holes... I've cracked to many deli containers trying to drill. Just remember that you want to convert during active growth and the plant size and root depth will determine how close to the drain holes you want to place your plant. The only plants that didn't like the transition were Oncidium twinkle and Macodes Petola...oh yea..and my Tolumnia..

[vcuchick]

My S/H supplies have arrived!!!! wahoooooo!!!!!!! I'm repotting these babies on Saturday morning and I'll post pictures of the process..

Now Ray of FirstRayOrchids recommends that once my 5 plants have been repotted, to put them into a shady/low-stress environment for about 2-3 weeks while they get established... (they're currently in an east facing window with air circulation 24/7 from a fan with a pebble tray)


What does that mean exactly?

[Plucky Purcell]

It means that the plant needs time to heal and get settled in it's new home. After repotting most orchids can't uptake water and nutrients as efficiently as normal. During that time you want to keep 'em at a consistent temp and more shady than they usually like. The more light, the more the plant has to work and if it can't draw up as much water or nutrients as it needs it will use it's stored energy and water resulting in slower growth over the long term. (That stored energy and water are for producing new growth or flowers.) I have a corner that's my recent repot's home that has a north and an east facing window. Both have shear curtains so the light stays soft and low all day long. I also like to keep my recent repots on a heating pad. This really seems to help root growth.

[PhalPal]

Would someone like to recommend First Rays in the Geeks Recommendations thread????? (a little advertising here!!) I have never used them but their good name seems to come up a lot on various threads. If someone thinks highly of them, add your recommendation here: http://www.orchidgeeks.com/forum/gen...endations.html

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by PhalPal

Would someone like to recommend First Rays in the Geeks Recommendations thread????? (a little advertising here!!) I have never used them but their good name seems to come up a lot on various threads. If someone thinks highly of them, add your recommendation here: http://www.orchidgeeks.com/forum/gen...endations.html

DONE! I added them....thanks!

[NicC]

I just want to emphasize, you need to wash PrimeAgra several times as it has some sort of toxic material as it comes from the vendor.
Nick

[Brooke]

Nick what type of toxic material is on Prime Agra? I am on my second huge bag of PA and have never had a problem with it. I rinse with a thorough spray of water and put it in a pot. I don't even soak it for an extended period of time.

Brooke

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by NicC

I just want to emphasize, you need to wash PrimeAgra several times as it has some sort of toxic material as it comes from the vendor.
Nick

Yup! I had it soaking from about 3pm yesterday to 8am this morning in plain spring water. I just changed out the spring water for fresh stuff and added the root stimulator stuff and fertilizer. Now it will sit soaking until tomorrow about 9am when I plan to come back into my office and take over the kitchen repotting my 5 plants that have been selected for S/H.

(silly, I know but it's working...) I put the LECA PrimeAgra pellets into a 10 gal spring water delivery bottle...you know, the blue ones the trucks deliver to businesses? I've been using that to soak the LECA since I don't have a washtub or basin to use and actually, It's working great!!!! hahaha My coworkers are laughing at my "cocoa puffs" in the big blue bottle...

[vcuchick]

Here's an S/H watering question-

Once all is said & done and my plants are in their new pots, how do I tell when it's time to water them again?

[Fishmom]

It's easy to tell, vcuchick. Assuming you are using containers with a reservoir below a drainage hole(s), the water level will be at the hole when you water. You will see the water level drop as it evaporates or is used by the plant. You can just top it up with fresh water as needed. I do that during the week, and flush it thoroughly to get rid of salts when I do my weekly watering.

[NicC]

Originally Posted by Brooke

Nick what type of toxic material is on Prime Agra? I am on my second huge bag of PA and have never had a problem with it. I rinse with a thorough spray of water and put it in a pot. I don't even soak it for an extended period of time.

Brooke

Brooke,
Ray from FirstRay encourages thorough washing since it apparently carries some salts (not referring to sodium chloride but salts in the broader chemical sense). I just finished my 18 month experiment with S/H and almost lost all the plants. I even had some aerial roots head down to the LECA and turn back up. When I salvaged the plants that had not died they had very short roots and very dehydrated tops. Maybe I just had bad luck but, inspite of being a novice, I've been otherwise fairly successful in my growing.
Nick

[vcuchick]

oh that's lovely...

I'm really hoping Nick I am NOT going to have that problem...Do you have any idea why this particular growing method didn't work for you? Or anyone who has encountered problems? I'd really like to be pro-active here.

[Brooke]

Nick I think you picked the wrong plants. Not ALL orchids like s/h and I have had very mixed results with it. It had nothing to do with the media prep because in the beginning I did prep it, just like Ray said.

I tried three phals in s/h - two tried to commit suicide and one loves it. The green leaved paphs loved it, the patterned leaved paphs struggled. Some catts loved it, some struggled. I even had some phrags hate it. My biggest success was with the oncidium family, they all loved it.

I now use the Prime Agra to pot all of my catts and some other genera that need a quick wet/dry cycle. I probably will never plant a catt in a bark mix again. I give them a quick rinse in a colander and pot the plant. I am using a pot with drainage, not a pot with standing water in the bottom.

Brooke

[awhoward]

did you say that you dont use a resevoir of water Brooke? Is it possible that the phals didnt work out because they were getting to dry without the wicking action of the water from the reservoir to the media and the phal that did work just got watered more? Do you think the Mottled leaf paphs were getting to dry also? Im just wondering because i to am getting ready to pot some orchids in S/H but with a resevoir and hydroton. Im going to be planting a noid phal, a oncidium 'Sharry Baby', a Brassidium Shooting Star 'Black Gold'
and a Paph Hsinying Alien. Thanks !

[Brooke]

awhoward I now use the Prime Agra strictly as a media in a pot in the manner you would use bark.

When I tried the s/h I used regular s/h pots with the typical holes/reservoir. The plants either loved it or hated it. I decided to change everything but a few plants back to my regular potting method for uniformity.

You will know if the plants are unhappy in time to change them if it is necessary.

Brooke

[vcuchick]

Awhoward,

I'll be looking forward to talking to you after you repot to hear about your experience and how your plants are doing...

Ok, BIG POT UP tomorrow...I'll try to post pictures some time with weekend of the whole process. We'll cross our fingers and toes and hope I'm not to have S/H hating plants....see the reservoir, beeeee the reservoir....ooommmm...

[awhoward]

most definately vcuchick. I should be recieving my supplies by monday or tuesday from firstrays and hope to pot up the day i get them lol. I will post pics when i get them potted up. Im scared though that im gonna kill them. Hopefully they like the S/H.

[NicC]

in addition to possibly not washing the PrimeAgra enough, I may not have been as careful in being sure the plants were in a root-growth cycle. I tried a Brassia, a dendrocillium, a Catt genera cross, and a Brsdm.
I was fastidious with weekly flushing the medium and feeding 3 of 4 weeks. On the 4th week I flushed the medium for a few minutes. I used tap water but our water is supposed to be OK and I have not had problems using it except for genera that are known to be fussy about water.
I rarely resorted to just refilling the reservoir.
Nick

[vcuchick]

ok, for better or worse, I repotted 5 of my plants this morning...here's the process!!! The group shot is the before photo---- I have 2 NOID phals in one pot that will stay together (potted in sphag) 1 NOID phal that was a rescue that's already grown a new leaf and some roots, 1 Den noble yellow song, one Onc. Mtmd Ruffles, and one Onc. Sweet Sugar being repotted.

[vcuchick]

My onc. twinkle was the only one left out of the fun...my bos from Ray's arrived...Hormones? I'm giving my plants hormones? Oh that's kinda neat! My poor Onc with their pleated pseudobulbs...*sigh* I really hope this method helps them out!

[vcuchick]

The pots from Ray's were deeper than I expected, so I'm hoping this works out. #2- my work space for the repot, #3- the usual vessel I used to presoak my LECA beads, weird but effective! #4- my 2 NOID phals removed from their pot (the sphag moss was like stone! I had to soak it to make it softer) #5- my other NOID phal that was my rescue project (I still have yet to see this one bloom- I think it's red?) #6- my rescue NOID phal after repot. #7- my Onc Sweet Sugar after potting, #8- my bilat NOID phal after potting (poor thing looks lost in that pot, but the root ball is very big) #9- my Onc Mtdm Ruffle post repot, #9- my Den Noble being soaked to remove old bark (root ball was quite crazy!!!)

[vcuchick]

#1- Den Noble after repot. #2- the whole gang after repotting, #3 & 4- the final product. (off screen on left is a small fan going 24/7) they were moved to the south facing window to adjust to new S/H then in about a month, I'll move them back to the eastern window they were before I started this...

Okay, so ready or not, I am now an S/H grower. (cross your fingers I haven't doomed any plants!) hahaha I really do think this will help them out in the long run...


I would love to get feedback on this project. I'll post pictures every few weeks/months to show their progress.

[NicC]

as best one can tell from pictures you seem to have done a great job. I don't have a sense of over or under potting.
Good luck.
Nick

[Fishmom]

The potting series looks great! My Onc. Sharry Baby 'yellow panda' had a bunch of pleated leaves and after 9 months in S/H has lush, healthy new growth, so I expect yours will do well also.

I'm really impressed by the roots on your nobile den. I've never gotten a den to grow that many roots under any circumstances, so you must have been providing good conditions. Hope it continues to do as well!

[vcuchick]

Thanks! I can't wait to see what they do in this new medium...last year, that Den grew three new caines that didn't bloom back in Feb/March (I only had one blooming caine) I'm really hoping this year I'll get it to pop like popcorn!

Fishmom,

Did you notice any changes in your Onc pseudobulbs?

[PhalPal]

Wow!! You did great!!!!

[vcuchick]

Thanks! the litmus test is a few months though to see if they're still alive...

[LouisW]

Looks clean and professional! Your plants are going to love it. Be aware that because you repotted all your plants at the same time, the plants which are actively growing roots will adapt fastest and the ones who are not may just sit for a while. Good luck, looks great!

[vcuchick]

Originally Posted by LouisW

Looks clean and professional! Your plants are going to love it. Be aware that because you repotted all your plants at the same time, the plants which are actively growing roots will adapt fastest and the ones who are not may just sit for a while. Good luck, looks great!

The reason I repotted so many at once is because ALL of them were growing roots and leaves and it was a now or wait another year...we'll see! I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed!

For my large NOID phal, what if the LECA has settled over the weekend to allow some roots to show again...should I add more LECA or leave them exposed?

[Fishmom]

"Did you notice any changes in your Onc pseudobulbs?"

vcuchick, the bulbs on that plant are fairly smooth and they never were ridged very much, so no, most of the change was in the leaves. I have another Sharry Baby, "sweet fragrance", which has bulbs that are very deeply ridged, and I'm thinking of switching it over to S/H. It will be interesting to see if the bulbs change if I do that. I have the impression that the bulbs don't plump up very much once they have ridges, but the new ones might be smoother.