spike or new growth...what do you think?

[katrina]

This is my Cycnoches Jean E Monnier...bloom size plant and I've been very patiently waiting and watching for any signs of a bloom. I just got it last summer (along w/a Cycnodes Wine Delight ‘JEM’) so not having had one before I don't really know what I'm looking at here.

The timing seems off for a new growth but then again...this guy still has all but 2 of his lowest leaves so perhaps he's just confused.

I can't tell...spike or new growth...what does everyone think? I'm sooooo hoping a spike start.

[katrina]

Anyone

[bloomorchidguy]

Given your location is fairly close to me Kat, here's my thoughts. I have probably about a dozen Cycnoches Jean E Monnier plants in the greenhouse. Almost all of them bloomed in mid Nov and very early Dec.

Another thing to point out is I've never seen a Monnier spike from the base of the bulb. Most tend to spike from the first or second leaf axial. Also they tend to throw a spike first, bloom, then drop their leaves for a winter rest.

My guess would be a growth. Once it would get a bit bigger it would be easier to tell. I'm starting to a growth here and there on my Cycnoches, Mormodes, and my Catasetums.

Troy

[katrina]

Darn! I was hoping spike. Oh well...new growth is good too.

My understanding of the culture/habits of these plants during the fall and winter and then early spring is as follows:

• Drop leaves (some before/some after flowering)
• Winter dry rest - once leaves drop/begin dropping reduce water and water only enough to keep psbulbs from shriveling
• New growth begins
• As soon as I see roots on new growth...repot and begin watering/fertilizing heavily.

Correct?

If the repot part is correct...since I am seeing what is probably a new growth...when roots begin....should I go ahead and repot and just assume it's skipped a beat in the 'normal' leaf drop cycle? My cycnodes looks like the leaves will drop...this one doesn't.


Thanks so much for your help Troy!

[bloomorchidguy]

Well a repot is always helpful. I tend not to repot all of mine every year due to the task of over potting or under potting. Sometimes its hard to find that right size pot for these guys.

Secondly it is not uncommon for some members of these genera to never loose their leaves during their winter rest. I have a Catasetum Black Jade that never looses its leaves in the winter. No matter how dry I keep the plant. They turn brown look ugly but don't drop until the new growth is reaching about 2/3 maturity.

Troy

[katrina]

I would say this one is in need of an up-pot. Based on what I'm seeing now, it doesn't look like he'll lose his current roots (which I've read does happen) so it's a bit crowded (clear pot- I can see inside). The roots are even growing out the bottom. Plus, I was thinking about using a slightly different media in order to retain more moisture. I used bark when I got him...small pot + bark = too dry, too fast, during the hot summer days. When the days were real hot, many times I was watering 2x/day. Hmmm...perhaps that's why he's not blooming...didn't get enough moisture this past summer. ??

I guess there's no "in stone" w/these guys (re: leaf drop)...then again, this shouldn't surprise me because I've discovered the same w/many other orchids too.

Thanks again for your help and input...much appreciated!!

Hopefully later this year I'll have some blooms from this one that I can share. The pictures I've seen sure are pretty...it'd be nice to see one in person...especially on a plant I've grown.

[LouisW]

When the plant begins to grow roots continue to wait a little while. The roots begin to grow in anticipation of rain. When the get two or three inches long start watering and keep it nice and moist and lay on the fert.

[rcb]

Two of my catasetum types have put out new leads already also. I do want to second that wait until the roots are a couple inches long before you start watering. I grow my Catasetums in spagnum in net pots, and I underpot them. When they do drop their leaves, I remove most of the spagnum. I just started doing this a year ago, and this past summer's growth were gigantic compared to other years, and my blooming was much better also.

Also, yes some don't loose their leaves, especially ones with a lot of pileatum in the background.

[katrina]

Lewis and rcb -- I've never stopped watering this one...or the other plant. I've definitely reduced the water over what they were getting in the summer and early fall...but I didn't stop watering. The leaves seemed fine and the roots have continued to grow...my thinking...if the plant is active and growing, I shouldn't cut off the water.

So...could the fact that I continued to water have caused the lack of flowers? I can't find anything on the web or in my books that states the flowering is triggered by a dry season (ie no water).

Since we are past any and all possible flowering...and because I do have active growth occurring...should I go ahead and repot now or wait until those roots grow out?

As for the watering...no signs of rot going on. The pbulbs (if that's what they're called on these guys) are firm and healthy so I'm hesitant to cut off the water. I'm thinking once the roots get to be 2-3" then I'll simply increase the water back to summer levels. Sound good?

Ok...so that was a very disorganized group of thoughts and questions...sorry for that. Hope my mutterings make sense.

Thanks for your help guys!

[rcb]

Kat,

What works for me - and again, everyone's conditions are different - when I get a new lead on a Ctsm and the plant still has the previous years leaves, I still stop watering at that point and wait until the new growth has the roots. By stop watering, I don't mean completely withholding water, I will mist it lightly (as if a dew), making sure to get the side of the plant w/o the new growth. I control this by making sure the side of the plant with the new lead is facing away from me. Maybe I'm overcareful, but when I started growing these plants, I rotted quite a few of them.

Renee

[rcb]

sorry realized I didn't answer your main question. I would wait to repot until the new growth has roots for two reasons. First, when the lead is real small, it is really easy to accidentally break it off while repotting (experience here LOL) second, that way when the plant is repotted, you can give the new medium a good long soaking to get it started.

Here is how I grow my Ctsm types.

When a new lead has roots 2 - 3 inches long, I repot (every year) in a net pot with spagnum/perlite very loosely. As soon as the weather allows, I do move mine outside where they are hung. Water as approaching dryness, but do not allow the plant to remain constantly wet. Heavy fertilizer I add some osmocote when I repot them. I put them in very bright lite. They actually receive direct sunlight mornings and afternoons. When fall comes, I start watching them. At the point when there are only 1 or 2 yellowing leaves left on the plant, I remove the spaghnum and place the plant in a new pot that will fit the next years growth. The plant, since it has no medium it is then misted every couple days or so, I actually like to see some slight shriveling.

A note about the pots. Since I have so many of these kind (> 30), and I repot every year, it was beginning to get unmanageable with the expense, and/or cleaning of the pots. so starting last year, I bought a roll of insect screen at the home improvement store (< 5 dollars) and I sew a pot using fishing line as the thread. It takes me about 5 minutes to do so, and is much cheaper. I can throw away the pot after it is done.

I hope this is helpful.

[katrina]

Very helpful...THANKS!!!


And, thanks everyone else for your input on this...much appreciated!