tell me what is wrong!!

[SShide77]

Ijust depotted my mini NOID phal for the first time since ive had it. It was very tightly packed in its original pot. I got it out and found that although most of the roots seem green and firm, they have some black spots on them and also seem to be broken in some areas. below is a picture. can anyone tell me if something is wrong and what to do?

thanks!
sarah

[clarita]

They are beginning to rot. More importantly how did she get in this condition? Usually over-watered and underlight, temps?. What are your conditions? What is air movement?

I don't trim dead roots, especially when they are like yours I use Bayer 3 in 1 in a hefty dose and let it sort itself out. Adjusting the growing area conditions will avoid this in the future

[SShide77]

How do you se bayer 3 in 1? Ive never heard of its usage with orchids before. I keep my orchids in a south facing window with a flourescent light on my phals because they are back a little than my other orchids. Its possible i may have overwatered this one, but temps are just fine. What should i do now that I have it out of its pot?

[articuno75]

There are several types of Bayer. I use the one for Shrubs, Flowers, Trees. (It's the 3 in 1 and comes in a ginormous bottle.) The ratio is 5 1/4 tablespoons to a gallon of water. It's systematic and it doesn't hurt the orchids.

[Anton]

SShide77 look up the Skewer technique for measuring moisture levels.

This will ensure you don't over water or under water your Phals.
Skewer use for watering of orchids

I use it on all my orchids with success.

[SShide77]

So, I can repot the orchid as is? Then water it using the bayer 3 in 1? Does physan 20 do the same thing? I have some on the way that i got online/.

[articuno75]

Originally Posted by SShide77

So, I can repot the orchid as is? Then water it using the bayer 3 in 1? Does physan 20 do the same thing? I have some on the way that i got online/.

No. Bayer you spray directly onto the plant and let dry. Do not let it get to the roots and don't water for at least an hour after treatment. Do read the instructions prior to use.

[SShide77]

Idont have any bayer though, so in the mean time, what should i do with the plant?

[Brooke]

SShide77 - Your orchid isn't really in that bad of shape. The broken roots are quite common when buying an orchid but they are still functioning but I would trim PART of the broken ones off. Trim just the really long ones, not the shorter ones. Dab the end of the cut with cinnamon to seal the wound. Try to keep the cinnamon off any part of the root but the cut end. After the cinnamon is dry, you can repot.

You can get the Bayer 3 in 1 product at any box store. It is a fungicide/mitecide/fertilizer combo and it is systemic. After you water the plant, you can pour this through the media and the roots will absorb the product and send it through the plant system. You can also use it on the foliage if you want.

If it were my plant, I would skip the Bayer - it really isn't in bad shape and just a repotting in new media will be all it needs to rebound.

Brooke

[Cynthia, Prescott, AZ]

Well, I don't think you guys are being clear on the Bayer Advanced 3 in 1. There is a version that has fungicide, insecticide and fertilizer, but not the Bayer 3 in 1 that handles mites. It does not contain fertilizer, and a good thing, as we want to go easy on the fertilizer with orchids. Using this product for a fungicide is OK if that is all you have, but I would prefer a pure fungicide, cinnamon, Phyton 27, or Cleary's 3336 (thiophanate methyl), with Physan 20 very far down the list. Use one of these as a drench of the pot, and spray the roots directly if you have as chance during repotting.

The plant looks fine to me. Those breaks are old, and if there has been no rot progressing thru them by now, there won't be any in the future, if you are careful not to flex the breaks too much. Clearly, who ever put the plant into the pot had a root system to large for the pot and broke the roots getting them into the pot. I have a new technique to get extensive and awkward roots into small pots that does not break roots much. I have described it else where. Pot it up as is and don't worry about the breaks, and if you use a slightly larger pot, you should have no trouble getting the roots into the pot.

[sandra]

Originally Posted by Cynthia, Prescott, AZ

I have a new technique to get extensive and awkward roots into small pots that does not break roots much. I have described it else where.

Where did you originally post this Cynthia? I'd be interested to know.

[SShide77]

Great, thank you Cynthia. I have potted it into a larger pot, i dont know how the heck it was even potted into its previous pot. The pot was a 2" pot and the roots just seemed CRAMMED into, it was hard to get out. Anyways, I hope that it likes its new bigger pot (about a 4" pot) even better.

[Cynthia, Prescott, AZ]

Here is the thread where I talk about the process.
Vanda Emergency
I just did this to a Vanda that I got from Exotic
Orchids of Maui. It had been grown half way to maturity in a black plastic basket, with most of the very extensive roots growing straight down out of the basket. After cutting the basket away, I cut off the thinner roots, those about spaghetti sized, as there just wasn't going to be enough room for all those roots in a 4" azalea pot, even when bent like spaghetti. Worked like a charm. Even managed to get he Vanda centered in the small pot.

I don't like cutting off living roots ever, but I have a theory that an orchid grows as many roots as it needs, and when you grow a plant without a mix, as many far eastern growers do (empty basket culture), the plant has to grow many more roots to soak up enough water and nutrients during the brief time it is watered.

[Brooke]

My apologizes to the Board - I called the Bayer insecticide a mitecide and it is not. The insecticide is Merit in the product, it is systemic and does a great job on scale, mealies, aphids.

Bayer makes other products besides the 3 in 1 that is a little more specific and have no fertilizer in them that are safe for orchids. They offer a fungicide only, an insecticide only and a fungicide/insecticide combination and all available at big box stores. Using the product more than the recommended dosage is a waste of money, product and could do more harm than good.

SShide don't forget you can also use peroxide safely on orchids for minor problems. It is best to try the more gentle treatments than pulling out the big guns and dosing them. Be sure you let the media get dry before you water the next time. Drying out will help any small breaks heal on their own.

All those roots in a 2" pot - WOW - kudos to you - good growing.

Brooke

[clarita]

When I use the bayer 3 in one I never spray the plant. I mix it stronger than recommended and water. Not sure if the plant would benefit from spraying and its "gunky" when mixed more strongly. I hate cleaning leaves

The name is Bayer Advanced All in One Rose and Flower care. It is in a huge bottle 32 oz. Blue bottle in N America... and yes indeed I got that advice from Cynthia and am ever greatful for it. I had a problem that was severe and needed swift action. Tried Physan phyton 27 peroxide. Nothing worked. The Bayer in a higher, more frequent application worked and quite fast.

As I read the posts there is a lot of great info. I have to be honest about cinnamon. IME it is a really outdated method. The areas that are sprinkled never grow back or grow in some wierd way. I don't care how careful one is, it eventually impedes the plants progress. We have to water. It eventually gets everywhere. It never fully comes off/out. There are so many better products than an old school home remedy. Its kind of like the "chicken soup" method to me. 3% Peroxide would be better in a 1 shot straight application if you need something quick from a cabinet.

[SShide77]

Thanks, I think I will try the peroxide. Should I wait until it needs watered again?

[clarita]

sshide I would. Get it in some better light. That will dry it out faster. Its not an emergency so do it during your normal watering ritual ;-)

Let us know how it goes!

[Cynthia, Prescott, AZ]

Clara, I think there tends to be a bit of confusion with the Bayer products. The one I recommended was the 3 in 1 that is a miteticide and says 'mites' on the bottle. The All in one Rose and flower would be a good product except that it has fertilizer in it. You can check your labels and tell me if I am right. The 3 in 1 that is for mites is systemic for fungi and sucking insects, but is a contact killer for mites, so if someone is going to use it for mites, they will have to spray the undersides of all leaves. I have to report that I am trying to use the 3 in 1 for spider mites right now, and it does not appear to be doing the job, so at this point, I can't recommend it for mites. For other insects, drenching the roots should work well.