phal spiking sidewise - will this cause trouble?

[dipasquo]

I am pleased to say that a mini Phal that I bought off the clearance rack about 6 months ago is now putting out a double spike. What concerns me is that since the spikes are reaching for the sun (this plant is indoors about 4 feet back from a big window) they are growing at about a 45 degree angle rather than growing mostly straight up. I know that in the wild orchids don't benefit from growers who secure spikes to stakes for extra support, but I suspect that in the wild the plant itself may be at a different angle than they are typically potted. Picture is attached. Should I try to rig up some sort of support for these spikes or should I just let them grow as is and trust that they'll be strong enough to support buds and flowers?

[psyc1210]

My Phal spikes always start out at that sort of angle. I have slightly manipulated the one that I knew would get too heavy to hold it's own and then put a little stake in there and clipped it on. Some of my other Phals that are in spike, I am going to just let do their own thing. I would love to have them cascading naturally, rather than always staking them up.

[exasperatus2002]

No problem. you may want to try to train them if you it want to grow in a different direction.

[mayres]

The majority of my phals are exactly as yours is growing - naturally cascading flowers - much more natural looking. They will do excellent growing that way. In some cases if the spike is very thick and long you can turn the pot half way through their growth cycle and end up with a nice arching spike flowing over your plant - also left natural if desired. I've found that the stakes are really only needed to support the spike during transportation. Enjoy!

[dipasquo]

Great, thanks for the comments. I'll have to find a way to keep the pot from getting top-heavy, but other than that I'll probably let this guy grow as-is. I figure the most likely way me for me to screw it up is by messing around too much.

[11Orchid126]

I slip my top heavy plants into clay pots that act as sleeves. Sometimes I even put stones under the inside pot for more weight.

[kmarch]

Originally Posted by dipasquo

I am pleased to say that a mini Phal that I bought off the clearance rack about 6 months ago is now putting out a double spike. What concerns me is that since the spikes are reaching for the sun (this plant is indoors about 4 feet back from a big window) they are growing at about a 45 degree angle rather than growing mostly straight up. I know that in the wild orchids don't benefit from growers who secure spikes to stakes for extra support, but I suspect that in the wild the plant itself may be at a different angle than they are typically potted.

The spikes that grow straight up....they're reaching for the sun also. So there's nothing inherently "right" about a spike growing up instead of out. Youre right in your assumption that phals in the wild don't grow like we grow them in cultivation. In the wild they grow on their sides and hanging, the flower spikes grow mostly out and down.

Originally Posted by dipasquo

Should I try to rig up some sort of support for these spikes or should I just let them grow as is and trust that they'll be strong enough to support buds and flowers?

Staked or not, they'll be strong wnough to hold the flowers. I think the spikes are too far along to be straightened up (trained to go upright) without risking breaking them. If the plant were mine, I'd let it grow as it is, I'd watch it, and if it looks like it is getting too heavy, I'd add a stake for support only.

[pikevi]

I think both the spikes can be 'trained' to become erect.

The lower one may be a lot easier since it is still tender.

I have one NOID purple Phal which did the same;the spike grew almost parallel to the ground. It took a while but I made it straight although a curve was present at the base of the spike.

I used paper clips and rubberbands with the stake on the opposte side from that of the spike.

Good luck in training...

[Halcyon]

I've heard that if you need to straighten a spike the best time is the evening, when the spike is apparently a little more pliable, but even then it must be done very gently and gradually. In this case the ties recommended were strips of nylon stockings, because they can be tightened easily.

[kmarch]

The best way to train a spike is as it is growing/emerging such that it grows into the shape/direction we want. After the stem gets to be a certain thickness they loose flexibility and you can't bend them too much without damaging them regardless of whether you bend them during the night or day.

[Ellen]

There's no reason not to stake a spike at this stage - just be careful when you're doing it. Phal spikes are fairly pliable even when they're large. The thing you don't want to do is turn the plant around with respect to the light, so that it gets an odd kink in the spike. Just keep it growing in the same direction so that it will be straight.

[dipasquo]

I think I'll be taking a conservative approach and letting the spikes continue to grow how they please, as long as there's no concern that they'll not support eventual buds and flowers. If I had more plants I might take a chance trying to train the spikes upright, but this is the only thing that I have in spike right now so I'd hate to damage it. Thanks again.

[Hummer344]

I agree with KMarch, the older the spike gets the harder it is to train or stake up. I stake all mine just because I don't have the room for them to cascade. I soon as the spike is long enough I put in a stake and start tying it up. When the spike starts to show the nubs of blossoms I stop tying it and let it bend naturally.

[kmarch]

Originally Posted by Ellen

There's no reason not to stake a spike at this stage ...

Above I gave a couple of reasons not to stake at this point.

Originally Posted by Ellen

Phal spikes are fairly pliable even when they're large.

I simply disagree wiht this claim. The more mature (thicker and heavier) a spike grows, the less pliable it is. If it is to be trained, the best thing to do is train it as it grows, not force it later.

[dennis]

if the buds are forming you should leave it alone as the buds form to open towards the light. by changing it you cause the guds to try and reposition themselves which can bring out a less than desirable display of bblooms pointing in a wide variety of positions

[dipasquo]

No buds yet that I can see - but I am very conscious to reposition the plant with the same orientation to the light each time I move it to water it. I do have a question about budding, though, that I'm sure I can learn from this forum. On a sunny day this plant gets 3-4 hours of direct light in the morning/early afternoon. I don't want to risk bud blast with too much light but don't want to change the light conditions too early either. Is there a point in bud development when I should move the plant out of direct light?

[PhalPal]

I have a few mini Phals and 45 degrees seems to be the way they want to grow spikes. I love cascading flowers and have very few Phals that I stake upright, and these are usually much larger flowers/spikes. Why take the chance of snapping a spike??? It will be beautiful as it is. Send pictures when it blooms please!

[kmarch]

Originally Posted by dipasquo

Is there a point in bud development when I should move the plant out of direct light?

There are a couple of concerns here:
1) most folks don't grow their phals in any direct light to begin with, but....
2) moving a phal in bud can cause the buds to blast. Phals are kind of touchy about beign moved when in spike. They're prone to bud blast. I'd estimate at least once a month we get a new member on the forum who's first post reads somethign like: "I just brought home my first phal and it's DYING!!!! I've had it only a week and all of the buds have fallen off. HELP!!!"

So I'm finding myself in a bit of a dilemma as ot what advice to give because on one hand direct light (unless it is perhaps an early morning eastern light) isn't recommended yet neither is movign the phal when in bud....

[dipasquo]

I live in an urban apartment so all of my plants are indoors; finding ideal lighting situations is difficult, unfortunately. This plant, specifically, sits on a radiator about 3 feet back from a southern wall and gets light through a glass door that leads out to a fire escape. In the summer time the sun is high in the sky and no direct light reaches the plant. It's in the winter time with the sun lower that direct sun reaches it for a few hours a day. There are no buds visible yet which is why I wonder if I still have time to move it. On the other hand, I have almost no "bright but not direct" lighting - so if I do move it I'm afraid it won't be happy about the sudden absence of sun energy and might abort the spikes altogether. Of course it's moot right now since we're in the middle of rain storms, but maybe on the next few sunny days I'll watch closer to see what hours this orchid is getting direct light and put a thermometer next to it to watch the temperature, too.

[Brooke]

I think your phal will be fine getting the direct light. Check the foliage of the plant when the sun is on your leaves and if they have a warm to the touch feel and not a hot feeling, they will appreciate the additional light. A rotating fan on the leaves will also help keep them cooler.

The possibility of bud blast might be more of a concern from the radiator or lack of humidity.

Disclaimer - I grow my phals in a g/h where they grow until about 1 p.m. in 3000 fc's before the inside shade cloth puts them in the 1500 fc range. When I grew them under lights, they spent the summer in my sunroom where they received sun from 6 p.m. until dark. Both g/h and sunroom growing were accompanied by fans.

The only downside to the increased light is smaller leaves, shorter spikes and smaller sized blooms. The upside is increased spikes, buds and branching.

Brooke