using epsom salt?

[bluelime00]

I am suspecting that some of my orchids are deficient in magnesium because of the discoloration of some leaves(Like yellowish to greenish).

I want to try to use epsom salt but I don't know how to use it. How many times should I use it and what dilution rate.

Thank you.

[madphrag]

I would start with testing the pH of the water you use before assuming a magnesium deficiency. A pH imbalance, too high or too low, can lock out magnesium and other nutrients.

[mehitabel]

Hi from St Louis, Madphrag!

Bluelime, yellow/green leaves are one of the signs of heat/light stress in many orchids, including phals and catts. Is it possible your orchids are getting too much light? When this happens, the orchid often can adapt to the higher light and the new leaves come in tougher and a better green color.

What kind of orchids do you have, and how much light are you giving?

That said, I have used epsom salts from time to time for greening fragrants such as jasmine and gardenias, which tend to get chlorotic over the winter here. I have also used it on orchids for toughening leaves, which it does do. And with success sometimes in correcting the green color (and sometimes no success).

I never noticed any harm from using it, but I've never used it regularly, only now and then. I know some phal growers recommend its use app once every three months or so and before trying to induce flowering. It is said to improve the color of blooms, but I don't know that of my own experience.

I used at 1 tbsp/gallon, but have also used it dry, a pinch or so to a small pot, and a teaspoon or so on top of the pot to be watered in at the next watering or rain.

Madphrag is correct that too much of the ES can block out other nutrients, but I always felt a one- or two-time dose could do only limited damage in that direction.

[orchids4me]

Hi
I have no input just linking to follow thread to learn about this topic.
Thanks
Emmaye

[E-Jag]

I use it 3 or 4 times per year. I can't say as I notice much of a difference, but I don't believe it's doing any harm; I figure just because I don't see some improvement somewhere doesn't mean it isn't there. I've spoken with vendors/growers at shows who are adamant regarding it's benefits, whatever they may be, so....I've read to use it at the rate of 1 tablespoon per gallon every couple of months (which is what I do) or 1/2 tablespoon/gallon every month. Try it and see what you think - it won't hurt your plants but it will give you some basis for an opinion.

[madphrag]

Originally Posted by mehitabel

Hi from St Louis, Madphrag!

Bluelime, yellow/green leaves are one of the signs of heat/light stress in many orchids, including phals and catts. Is it possible your orchids are getting too much light? When this happens, the orchid often can adapt to the higher light and the new leaves come in tougher and a better green color.

What kind of orchids do you have, and how much light are you giving?

That said, I have used epsom salts from time to time for greening fragrants such as jasmine and gardenias, which tend to get chlorotic over the winter here. I have also used it on orchids for toughening leaves, which it does do. And with success sometimes in correcting the green color (and sometimes no success).

I never noticed any harm from using it, but I've never used it regularly, only now and then. I know some phal growers recommend its use app once every three months or so and before trying to induce flowering. It is said to improve the color of blooms, but I don't know that of my own experience.

I used at 1 tbsp/gallon, but have also used it dry, a pinch or so to a small pot, and a teaspoon or so on top of the pot to be watered in at the next watering or rain.

Madphrag is correct that too much of the ES can block out other nutrients, but I always felt a one- or two-time dose could do only limited damage in that direction.

Hello fellow St. Louis dweller! The reason I brought up the pH possibility is the fact that I was having related problems my self. Come to find out, here in St. Louis, our water supply is consistently in the 9.8 to 10.0 pH range. Making the adjustment with phosphoric acid and pH strips made a world of difference.

[mehitabel]

Just remembered: when I have used ES on a yellowish orchid, the yellow leaves don't always change color very much, but the new leaves come in beautiful.

Originally Posted by madphrag

Hello fellow St. Louis dweller! The reason I brought up the pH possibility is the fact that I was having related problems my self. Come to find out, here in St. Louis, our water supply is consistently in the 9.8 to 10.0 pH range. Making the adjustment with phosphoric acid and pH strips made a world of difference.

Hi, again! I knew the water was hard, but had no idea of the pH. It's the hard water that makes jasmines and gardenias go clorotic over the winter (no idea what the mechanism is, just know it happens). About two waterings with epsom salts (and the end of winter) seemed to fix them up. That's why I tried it on some yellowish orchids, mostly new ones.

I'm not very precise with measurements, so I've never had the courage to try adjusting pH. I'm pretty sure I would poison something. I do use coco chips as a medium, and that's supposed to (hopeIhope) keep the pH in the pot close to 7. My orchids seem to do ok, tho I suppose they could do better Aside from sunburn I don't get yellow leaves.

[madphrag]

Here is a TWQ for my area:

http://www.amwater.com/files/MO_6010716_TWQ.pdf

[bluelime00]

Thank you every one for your tips, suggestions and informative information about this thread. I am growing different genera outside and receiving direct morning sun until 10 am and filtered sun for the rest of the day.. But mostly the Vandas and Oncidium got this discoloration and I suspect it's magnesium deficiency. I don't know about my water ph level as I have no tools of measuring them.

I believe everybody's right , giving it a try will not harm my plants and if everything doesn't change I think light intensities is the culprit and I should not worry.

[Ron]

Hi. Water quality could be the cause of the problem.
When useing epson salts always use it alone as it not compatable with some chemicals used in fertilizer.
I use it regulary on my Cymbidiums at 2 teaspoons per gallon and pour over the leaves and plants in summer.
One a week or so, works wonders in the growing season.
Phallies about 1 a month or so, Paphs, Catts etc about the same in summer and Autumn, always just mixed in water by itself.
Hi Ph in the water perhaps could cause a lock up of many chemicals, I never had this problem as out water (tap) is about 7.5 to 8 now.
In the drough it was much higer.
I use rainwater only on my plants in the greenhouse
Good growing
Ron

[Ron]

Hi further to above statement.
I have read over the years they is not a great deal of worry if overdosing with Epsom salts as it breaks down very quickly over a few days, absorbed by the plants leaves and roots quickly also.
One test tried to kill the plant by overdoses Cymbidiums with about 4 teaspoons of dry powder on top of the plant and water in.
Plant did not seem to be in any problems with that amount allthough I would not recomend or try it.

A lot has been written over the years and some goood articles produced
Check out Epsom Salts
Another article I read was that magnesium sulphate is as important to a plants leaf structure and growth as is iron to hemoglobin in humans blood
Ron

[berniep]

G'Day Bluelime00

This is the way I do it

Epsom Salt Recipe

Firstly, make a concentrated Epsom Salt solution by adding 1 Tablespoon of Epsom Salts to 1 litre of water.
Then apply this once a fortnight by diluting 1 part of the Epsom Salt Solution with 10 parts water, and watering over the entire plant.

Epsom salts is high in magnesium and acts as a sunscreen. It also helps the plant take up nutrients that they need to protect themselves, and for flowering later on.

Cheers
Bernie

[mehitabel]

Thanks for that article, Ron. I'm going to sprinkle some on tomorrow 1st thing. We're expecting rain.

[willowbanks]

bluelime00, you do not have a Magnesium deficiency, if you did your Vanda leaves would have a red appearance.

How about some photos of the problem on the Vandas and Oncidiums????

Bill

[PocoGigio]

Epsom salt=magnesium sulphate=MgSO4-7H20 (Wikipedia)
From these posts, it sounds like it's a winner to use regularly for the 'chids.
Now, my quick, dumb questions:
In MSU fertilizer for RO/rainwater is magnesium(Mg), does this ingredient accomplish the same thing as adding Epsom salt(MgSO4-7H20)? Is it really the same thing or completely different? I don't want to assume anything. (Afraid to overdose!)
Thanks again bluelime00 for another educational post!

[Stitz]

Mr Ray Orchid Growing Supplies Semi-hydroponics Hydroponics Orchid Books PrimeAgra provides a link Magnesium Supplementation which is a good reference for precisely this situation!

[PocoGigio]

Is there any question that Mr. Ray hasn't anticipated?! Amazing!

Excellent! Thanks Stitz and Ray!

[Stitz]

AND, my thanks go to bluelime00 for highlighting this question! I thought that my fertilizer included magnesium and I was incorrect. I will make immediate adjustments. I use a proportioner these days. I can add the additional epsom salts (which I already have in my shed!) g-r-a-d-u-a-l-l-y and watch the color changes in the leaves of my plants!

[Ray]

I'll throw in my 2 cents: Magnesium Supplementation Using Epsom Salt

[Jonsberg]

Hi Ray - I live in the tropics and add half a teaspoon of epsom salts to ordinary (nitogen) orchid food once a month. The salts will aid your orchids in making chlorrophyll and also helps them to absorb food (so my orchid friend who is a plant food chemist tells me). It can't do too much harm as long as you regularly flush out your potted orchids with clean water.

[Stitz]

Ray, check out the post which is #16 in this thread.....

[Ray]

Hah! Didn't see that.

Thanks, Stitz.

[BluPeaches]

Thanks for this. I never knew Epsom Salt could be used on plants.

[mehitabel]

Just to update this: It's been about a week since I put epsom salts in the pots and the newer leaves have turned a beautiful green, especially the violacea type with big granny-apple green leaves. Very nice color, looks healthy. Older leaves may have changed, but less visible.

[krpot]

So, I have very hard water like 7.6 ish pH. I know that some people either use distilled, bottled, rain, or R.O. water but does anyone know if it's ok to use ph buffers to lower ph. I have ph changing stuff that I use for my aquarium, and it doesn't kill fish so I hope/assume that it would be ok to use for the water for plants/orchids? Does anyone know if that's safe or will it just make the water toxic?