Hybrid paph with 2 different blooms?

[Forever-mango]

Today i recieved 2 blooming paphs with the same name. But have 2 colour morphs? The Hybrid is from Vietnam called "Paph. primulinum var. purpurascens x paph delenati". Apparently its 2 different morphs. I think one is normal colouration and the other is the albino form? Not sure.

But, being a hybrid between two Paphs. is it possible to have 2 different blooms or more?

Specimen #1




Specimen #2




Kind Regards,
Stephen

[Choodles]

Originally Posted by Forever-mango

But, being a hybrid between two Paphs. is it possible to have 2 different blooms or more?

The seedlings of any cross will each be a little different from their siblings. The "only" way to get two truly identical paph plants, species or hybrid, is to have two separate divisions of one plant. If the specific parent plants are different in the cross (ie, "plant one"= P. primulinum "A" x P. delanatii "A" and "plant two" = P. primulinum "B" x P delantii "B"), then you can expect even more variation.

[Stelios]

thankfully paphs are not mericloned yet, i am against identical plants e.g. in phals as it limits the biodiversity of their genetic material. As well put above your paphs look different because they are raised from seedlings.

[Forever-mango]

Would you still label them with the same names?

[Choodles]

IMO, they both look like Paph. Deperle. Deperle is the registered grex name (Deperle = prim' x del', source:The International Orchid Register | Royal Horticultural Society

do an image search for "Paphiopedilum Deperle", and you'll likely find quite a few flowers that look like each of yours.

[sruane]

Think about it like this, the plants are like siblings...they have the same parents, but don't look identical to each other...some siblings look more alike than others.

Your plants would have the same hybrid name (all plants from the same cross get the same hybrid name), but if you cloned one, it was have it's own clonal name. Paphs don't clone well though, so the only way to get an identical plant with Paphs is through division usually. Divisions from the same plant are clones of each other of course, as they are genetically identical.

[kmarch]

Originally Posted by Forever-mango

Today i recieved 2 blooming paphs with the same name. But have 2 colour morphs? The Hybrid is from Vietnam called "Paph. primulinum var. purpurascens x paph delenati". Apparently its 2 different morphs. I think one is normal colouration and the other is the albino form? Not sure.

But, being a hybrid between two Paphs. is it possible to have 2 different blooms or more?

It's quite normal for Paph Deperle to show a range of colours from white through to about a medium pink, sometimes with greenish or yellowish blushes as you can see in your white one. Because of that variation, both of your paphs would be considered "normal" colouration for a Deperle. Hybrids do not have "alba" designations or varieties (hybrids don't have varieties at all) so the white one isn't really an "albino."

While your particular Deperles may have been bred in Vietnam, the cross is actually not a Vietnamese cross but was made in France by famed orchid hybridizer Marcel Lecoufle and he is the one who registered that hybrid.

Originally Posted by Forever-mango

Would you still label them with the same names?

Yes, you would. Even though they look a little bit different they are still the same cross. The registration of hybrid names is based on breeding/lineage, not appearance.

Originally Posted by sruane

Your plants would have the same hybrid name (all plants from the same cross get the same hybrid name), but if you cloned one, it was have it's own clonal name. ...

Clonal names, properly called cultivar epithets, cultivar names, or just cultivars, are traditionally given when a plant is awarded through some awarding agency like the AOS, or AOC, not merely because a plant is cloned. Usually it's just the other way around. The plant is cloned because it has been awarded and it thought to be sellable. Each division of the original plant and any clones made of that plant caries the cultivar name. Sometimes people just slap a cultivar name on a plant for the fun of it or to tell it apart from another plant they have of the same species or cross. These names, because they are not registered in any way, are not really valid or binding.

Originally Posted by Stelios

thankfully paphs are not mericloned yet, i am against identical plants e.g. in phals as it limits the biodiversity of their genetic material. As well put above your paphs look different because they are raised from seedlings.

Just a quick comment on this. IMHO cloning does not have a significant impact on the biodiversity of orchids for 3 reasons: 1) The majority of cloned orchids are hybrids and not species; 2) cloned orchids are rarely if ever re-introduced back into the wild; 3) in cultivation, provessional breeders rarely if ever use clones in breeding programs. Originally, if I understand my orchid history right, cloning was done to make orchids more available to the mass market, not for any reasons pertaining to biodiversity.

[Stelios]

Originally Posted by kmarch

Just a quick comment on this. IMHO cloning does not have a significant impact on the biodiversity of orchids for 3 reasons: 1) The majority of cloned orchids are hybrids and not species; 2) cloned orchids are rarely if ever re-introduced back into the wild; 3) in cultivation, provessional breeders rarely if ever use clones in breeding programs. Originally, if I understand my orchid history right, cloning was done to make orchids more available to the mass market, not for any reasons pertaining to biodiversity.

It just bothers me having a million of genetically identical plants.