Cinnamon is a desiccant

[mehitabel]

I know lots of us here are fans of cinnamon for various purposes in growing orchids. I've said several times I believe cinnamon is a desiccant, but I finally realised why I think that:

I use cinnamon powder for all sorts of leaf problems-- tiny black specks on leaves, sunburn, bits of rot or broken areas on fragile new leaves. I use it on anything that doesn't "look right" on the leaves, especially the tiny, delicate new leaves, which are easily susceptible to any rot that might start. It has always worked. The tiny new leaves grow right thru the cinnamon. The bits of black or rot or whatever stop growing, and the rest of the leaf keeps right on growing.

I've also found it makes pests unhappy. A couple of times seeing tiny webs beginning in the crown of a phal, cinnamon got rid of the whatever it was. I even used it once on a "funny" green place I saw on an oncid pb that wasn't growing right. I didn't know what was wrong, but cinnamon has never hurt any leaf or pb I used it on, so out it came. The "funny green place" immediately began to thrash around as if it were being tortured, and turned out to be a couple of *catepillars* ensconced half hidden in the pb, and happily chomping away in secret.

So I suspected it was a drying agent or desiccant. But now I'm sure. When you get new phal violaceas, they often have extremely thin, delicate leaves. A couple of small ones that I put under lights in my west window got a big patch of sunburn. It was soft and transparent because the leaves were so thin, and I was afraid it would turn to rot and kill the little things off. So I got the old cinnamon out and dusted the damaged leaves all over, top and bottom of the burned leaves.

It's been about a week now, and the burned areas have dried up and shrunk. They's shrunk a lot, all of the previous burned area of nearly three inches shrivelling up to a half inch or so, but surrounded by healthy tissue. So yes, it's a desiccant, tho the cuticle on most phal leaves is tough enough so that the normal parts of a leaf are unaffected.

Knowing this should help people be able to use the powder more effectively-- when and when not to use.

(Also, note that roots don't have the protective cuticle of leaves, and the desiccant effect might be a detriment to roots in some uses)

[PhalPal]

Great info mehitable - Thanks!!!

[CharliesAngel51]

Like I said before.....Thanks.

[11Orchid126]

Great observation. Sounds very logical. Thanks for sharing your observation.

[orchidlover55]

That is great information mehitabel, I love cinnamon too, and just think we can get it all day long at Walmart for .50 a bottle so I just load up when I go. I have two bottles in the G/H all the time. Great smell too LOL

[jdmatthew]

It makes sense. I wonder if the anti-bacterial/microbial properties are due to this?

[Ray]

Cinnamon is a marvelous fungicide, but as Mehitabel says, it can dry out things like crazy. Get overzealous on roots, and your plants will never branch and grow new ones (just on cut ends is OK).

However, make an "infusion" in water or alcohol, and the fungicidal aspect of the cinnamaldehyde is retained while reducing or eliminating the desiccating effect:

Stir two tablespoons of cinnamon powder into about a pint of boiling water. Take it off the heat and let it steep for a couple of days. Pour through a coffee filter to remove the sediment, and spray away.

........OR (this is my preference):

Put a tablespoon of cinnamon powder into a pint of rubbing alcohol. Let stand for 24 hours, then filter. This is a great fungicide and insecticide, but the alcohol is a very slight desiccant, too. I have never seen it do any harm, but it might if overused.

[trinigirl]

Great information, and very timely. I have some plants right now that need help badly. I will be using some cinnamon on them pronto!

[jkcazares]

I use Worm Tea as a spray. Do you think I could mix the cinnamon "infusion" Ray spoke of above mixed in with my Worm Tea solution?

[lmartiny]

Good info. I'll have to come back and write it down tomorrow.
I dab Cinnamon on cuts and use Brookn"s recipe.
My son learned from a local orchid grower to mix Elmer's Glue with cinnamon and dab it on the brown spots. Any feedback on this?

[koshki]

Oops. I wish I had read this yesterday! I was a tad bit too liberal while repotting my phals! But they sure smelled good!

[Ray]

Originally Posted by lmartiny

Good info. I'll have to come back and write it down tomorrow.
I dab Cinnamon on cuts and use Brookn"s recipe.
My son learned from a local orchid grower to mix Elmer's Glue with cinnamon and dab it on the brown spots. Any feedback on this?

Yep, I learned that from the Ellenbergers in upstate NY many years ago.

Besides the 1) powder, 2) alcohol infusion, 3) water infusion), and 4) Elmers Glue poultice I have listed on my "Home Remedies" page, there is also a poultice made with cooking oil.

Additionally, I have actually cured athlete's foot using a poultice made with lanolin! (I must admit though, while you feet may smell nice, walking around with brown stuff between your toes is pretty disgusting.)

[myshka]

Originally Posted by Ray

Yep, I learned that from the Ellenbergers in upstate NY many years ago.

Besides the 1) powder, 2) alcohol infusion, 3) water infusion), and 4) Elmers Glue poultice I have listed on my "Home Remedies" page, there is also a poultice made with cooking oil.

Additionally, I have actually cured athlete's foot using a poultice made with lanolin! (I must admit though, while you feet may smell nice, walking around with brown stuff between your toes is pretty disgusting.)

please tell me you didn't do this in public....

[shaz]

Originally Posted by koshki

Oops. I wish I had read this yesterday! I was a tad bit too liberal while repotting my phals! But they sure smelled good!

I do my re-potting/pruning in the kitchen and my bf always thinks I've been baking and is disapointed when he finds out what I've been doing!

[jkcazares]

Ray, when you make the infusion where do you spray? On the roots or all over the plant? How often? I have had some fungus run rampant through my orchids and now I am concerned about the others. I want to use the alcohol infusion prophylactically. (spelling?)

[Zsophia]

I am going outside right now rub the newest sunburn on the Phal...

[mehitabel]

Thanks for the infusion recipes, Ray. I'm very glad to have them, and obviously others are, too. And BTW, I think I first learned about cinnamon from you some years ago

I've wondered about the effect of cinnamon on wounds of humans or animals. I'm curious about whether people used cinnamon poultices for wounds in the "old days". Anyone know anything about this, or where I could get information on it? I did try a dab of cinnamon on a tiny gouge on a finger. It burned like *heck* for a second or two, then nothing. The gouge did seem to heal up fast, but who can tell? For bigger wounds, I've never tried it-- decided to do the safe thing with neosporin

[Stitz]

mehitabel,
Cinnamon poultices have been used on wounds by people in India for millenia.

--Stitz--

[Ray]

Originally Posted by jkcazares

Ray, when you make the infusion where do you spray? On the roots or all over the plant? How often? I have had some fungus run rampant through my orchids and now I am concerned about the others. I want to use the alcohol infusion prophylactically. (spelling?)

I don't use it prophylactically, but when I spray, it's the whole plant.

Sorry for taking so long to respond.

[wasabi8888]

Originally Posted by Ray

Cinnamon is a marvelous fungicide, but as Mehitabel says, it can dry out things like crazy. Get overzealous on roots, and your plants will never branch and grow new ones (just on cut ends is OK).

However, make an "infusion" in water or alcohol, and the fungicidal aspect of the cinnamaldehyde is retained while reducing or eliminating the desiccating effect:

Stir two tablespoons of cinnamon powder into about a pint of boiling water. Take it off the heat and let it steep for a couple of days. Pour through a coffee filter to remove the sediment, and spray away.

........OR (this is my preference):

Put a tablespoon of cinnamon powder into a pint of rubbing alcohol. Let stand for 24 hours, then filter. This is a great fungicide and insecticide, but the alcohol is a very slight desiccant, too. I have never seen it do any harm, but it might if overused.

Hi Ray

If i use the 1st option (not your preference), is that more a fungicide or an insecticide or both?

I am hoping to use the recipe ("Best stuff Ever") as an insecticide as I am using Captan or Physan 20 as a preventive fungicide.

I do use the cinnamon powder but more to tackle any rots that I have. I also use the powder to dust any leaves or bulbs that i cut away...

Thanks

Jeff

[mehitabel]

Wasaabbi, just to make sure your question doesn't simply disappear, I'm bumping this with my opinion, waiting for an answer from Ray.

I don't know whether the cinnamon infusions Ray shared have insecticidal properties by themselves. However, if you add dishwashing liquid to the cinnamon infusion, that will add insecticidal properties. Soap dissolves the exoskeleton of insects, and they drown. I have killed many insects with soapy water, including aphids, scale, mealies, spikders, flies and wasps. A special soap is the major killing ingredient in commercial products like Safer's Insecticidal Soap.

You can follow the proportions recommended in the original cinnamon recipe. Just use enough to make the water really slick and that will do it.

I would rinse it off the leaves after the killing is done, and be careful with watering for a short period afterwards, as the detergent keeps the medium wetter than usual for a short time.

[exasperatus2002]

Alot of good info here. Thanks everyone.

[digitalgate]

i thought cinnamon taste good with chicken and buns

[dillon935]

Originally Posted by digitalgate

i thought cinnamon taste good with chicken and buns

That too.