Vanda Emergency

[dra]

Need help w/ 2 vandas. Both rescued from Lowes in January. Vanda bark in wooden slat baskets. Soaked everyday to keep moisture and humidity. Both facimg south - close to the glass window. Both declining rapidly -- leaves turning yellow then dropping off (plam tree stage?). Roots turn greenish when watered then turn back to a brownish color. New root coming out of one stalk and turned white yesterday. are they damaged from the spring sun? Can't figure out why the decline so fast. Bought syuperthrive this morning to help out. But don't really know what I did wrong. are they shedding all the old leaves to make room for the new ones?

[jay]

dra - I am sorry but I am unfamiliar with Vanda's, but some more information will be needed for others to help. One thing would be where are you located. We are from all over the world and have very different growing conditions. For someone to give you correct advise, they need to know what you are working with. If you could go to your profile and adjust your location it will help in the future as well.

Next, how are the roots that are in the bark? Do you have any pictures? The white and green roots are healthy, if you have brown and mushy roots then there may be a problem.

[dra]

Jay - thanks for the reply. I'm in the midwest - Michigan specifically. Will try to edit / update profile. As for the roots -- when I removed most (98%)of the bark, the roots were a deep dark green -- wood-type. Not fleshy like the Phal roots. Now they are brown (wood-like) and a tinge of green when moist. Color change in the root noticed only after I removed last week. Should I return the bark. No mushy roots. Mostly brown but not brittle. Than,s for the help.

[digitalgate]

can you post pictures? You are quite up north.. Meaning sunlight is a problem for you.
Vanda is a warming growing orchids , both humidity and light is a disadvantage for you.
All is not lost, post the picture and let see what we can do.

[chefatplay]

I agree with digital. You may need to put back in bark. My vandas are outdoors, barerooted like yours are now, but in FL humidity all the time. In the winter, I have them in full sun. Starting in spring, now, I get them in dappled sunlight. Remember, my sun is much stronger than yours. I haven't had any leaves fall off mine. It sounds like moisture. Still need a picture.

The roots are supposed to turn green when you water them. That's a sign they are absorbing water. Good thing..... They turn white when dry.

[dra]

thanks for the advice so far. Will try to post a picture. Have put the bark back. Both plants are in direct sunlight via south facing window. Is this too strong at this point -- sunburn? The top leaf is now showing some stress -- bottom leaves turning yellow. I am soaking both plants in water with a light fertilizer plus superthrive. What I don't understand is how they ar both declining rapidly now. I have been doing the same ritual for the past 3 months with no problem. Do you think that once I removed the bark it was losing too much moisture and thus humidity?

[brandank]

Hello dra, I am an outside vanda grower. I am still learning myself but, this is what I was told about vandas. 1. They love lots of sun. 2. They need to be watered a LOT if bare rooted. I am watering twice a day now plus fertilize 3x a week. 3. Because of the amount of sun they need a healthy vanda should have a yellow tint to it. Green is actually a sign of not enough sun. 4. Yes because of the sun the will sunburn or develop freckles but that does not harm them. Lots of Sun + Lots of Water = Happy Vanda. We need to see picks to really give your vanda's a diagnosis. Hope this helps a little bit.

[dra]

Another issue I have is the new root breaking through. Correct me if I am wrong, but the new root indicates that the plant is still trying to make it through? So a new question would also be how to keep it going and what to look for to tell me otherwise. I think the other one, though the roots get a little green when watered, the leaves are all brown and dried up. Do i cut that or continue hoping that it can revive during the summer.

[digitalgate]

you need a good light meter to measure how much light is falling on the leave.

[pitik101]

dra...yes your plant is still breaking thru...and is still alive and have adjusted to their surroundings. to keep them growing...keep on what you have been doing...BUT keep them a bit away from the window glass. I suspect you lost the leaves thru sun burn from the window glass

[dra]

Thanks for all the advice -- did move both vandas away from the window a bit. The spring sun is getting stronger -- they were both about a 12inches from the glass. I replaced the bark and started up again on the same routine. On the vanda with no leaves (the roots still get a green tint when I soak) and if the other vanda loses all its leaves(new root coming out) do I cut the stalk or hope a new stalk appears during the summer?
I just want them to hold on until I can place them outside ( a couple of weeks)

[Cynthia, Prescott, AZ]

Growing Vandas in a basket in a home is pretty difficult as humidity is usually not high enough for the roots to stay healthy. Most members here know I grow all my Vandas in pots. I have just come up with a neat way to get Vanda plants recently purchased with impossible to pot up roots sticking out to conform nicely to the pot without breaking the roots while bending.

I soak the roots reasonably well, then find a large pot that requires only a slight amount of bending. I ease the roots into the pot and put wet paper towels on top and press down some. This keeps the roots wet and helps to keep the roots from popping up out of the pot, and helps to train them downward if they have been growing upward. After about 12 hours (probably less would work, but 12 is what I did), you pull the bundle from the pot and ease it into the next pot size down, and repeat this over and over again until you are down to the size you want, with towels also pressed down further in the process if needed. Worked great on an Ascocentrum I got with roots sticking straight out.

[dra]

Cynthia -- thanks for the advice. Do you recommend soaking overnight (water plus SUPERTHRIVE) as a quick fix for the plant? I realize that Vandas need high humidity - does that translate to keeping the roots moist? Is there a difference?

[Aleksa]

Originally Posted by dra

Cynthia -- thanks for the advice. Do you recommend soaking overnight (water plus SUPERTHRIVE) as a quick fix for the plant? I realize that Vandas need high humidity - does that translate to keeping the roots moist? Is there a difference?

As much as I know there is big difference between high humidity and constant moisture. Vanda hates constant moisture, because it will cause root rot. Vandas in nature grow on trees and their roots are exposed to air and moisture (rains) periodically. So they like to be dry between waterings.

I am trying to find the balance between humidity and moisture. If humidity is low I water more frequent because the roots dry out fast. From my experience I noticed that chids like air humidity much more than 'liquid water' .

[digitalgate]

Dra stay Michigan, Cynthia's method might work for him/her. I am beginning to suspect
humidity is the problem. I remember when i wash jean , i left it in the bathroom and the
next day the pant is bone dry. Now if you ask me to do the same thing.The pants will
be very smelly by the second day and it is still wet!
Dra , you have to increase to humidity and still provide air movement for the plant.You might want to get a hygrometer to check if the humidity is above 60% and
temperature is above 70s all the time. (unless you want to bloom it)

[dra]

seems that humidity is the problem. But why the sudden turn for the worst so recently. During the winter months, the humidity is real low due to the heat from the furnace. So I soajked everyday, sometimes overnight. worked well and didn't drop any leaves. 4 months later, the leaves started to drop. Just turn yellow, then drop -- no browning. I'm assuming that because it is spring and the sun is getting stronger I should increase and keep steady a high level of humidity. I;'m going to soak everyday and mist. I appreciate all the advice so far. But I am curious to know what I did wrong in the past month.

[brookn]

dra, Tom has an ingenious way of getting humidity to his roots. I found this post for you. Maybe he might chime in on if it was sucessful.

Vase Culture

[digitalgate]

Dont soak the plant for too long and end up ... growing mold. black, soapy difficult to
get rid of...

[dra]

brookn - the vase idea looks good. I couldnt tell from the pictures, but is the plant in a wooden slat box inside the glass vase or is the plant in the vase w/o. Then the plant is just anchored by wires?

[dra]

I've decided to use either Cyhnthia's pot method or Tom's vase method to increase the humidity, and place them fatther away from the glass south window. But in the immediate short term, is there anything that I can do to stabilize the plants? Encourage root health/growth?

[dra]

Any short term solutions?

[brookn]

dra, I don't personally grow Vanda's, but it looks like Tom has it in something. I think it can be put into the vase bare root, or in a basket if you have one. I am not sure this would work well if it were in a pot as I am afraid it would encourage rot. I believe in the thread it said to use wire to stabilize. He goes by tom499, perhaps you could PM him? I don't believe he would mind.

[digitalgate]

use calcium nitrate to encourage root growth.Very diluted..But you still have not
mention what type of Vanda do you have. Strap leaves? Terete leave? quarter terete leave?semi terete leaves?
They have different lighting requirement.
The rule of thumb is that the shorter the plant and the broader the leaves, the more shade and water are needed.
Tall Vanda almost always require full or high sunlight to do well.
Terete and semi terete less than 1 cm diameter -full sun with support.
the rest usually some form of shade. or drappled sun light