Phal: had 2 leaves, now NO LEAVES!

[lisadpa]

Is this the end of my phal? A year ago it had four or five leaves. They seemed to go naturally over time and I wasn't terribly concerned. But this AM, my last remaining (green, healthy-looking) leaf just dropped. I couldn't believe it. And the plant has a beautiful, new, fast-growing spike. I can't imagine how it could have such a nice spike and drop all of its leaves. I've been very careful about watering using the skewer method (once I let it go a few more days than it should have, two waterings ago but other than that I've been consistent).

I MAY be getting a new leaf...there is the teeniest, tiniest very very light green triangle where my old leaves used to be...but I can't be sure. It is so tiny you almost can't see it, and if it is a new leaf it looks like it would take forever to grow. Here are some pics...you really can't see the little light green thingy in the picture.

What do you guys think? Is there hope for this plant? I never saw an orchid with NO leaves!

Will I get some blooms this spring? That is what I most want... Thanks!

spike:


New leaf? too small to see

[digitalgate]

try something else

[lisadpa]

can you be more specific??? That's hard to interpret.

[janet_a]

i suspect the plant had crown rot, and put up the spike as a last resort. what i would have done was cut the spike as soon as the leaves started dropping precipitously. i doubt there's much you can do now; have you pulled it out of the pot? what do the rest of the roots look like?

[lisadpa]

I have not pulled it out. My roots never looked great from the day I got the plant. The ones that are visible are long gone (straw-like) and even when I poke into the potting material most of what is visible is more of the same. I figured I had to have some nice roots somewhere down there because the plant was bursting with blooms when I received it...I am so disappointed. I nurtured it lovingly for almost a year and waited so patiently for this Spring to come and when I saw that spike I thought it had to be a wonderful thing.

I'm not looking forward to pulling out the plant, what should I expect to see if it's crown rot? And what about my apparent new little leaf?

[mayres]

"If" you have crown rot there will be no little leaf coming out the top. As long as you genuinely have a leaf coming there is hope. If you are serious about still trying to save the plant I would remove the flower spike - the plant needs to concentrate on rebuilding itself. In truth, a plant in the condition you describe will take several YEARS at best to creep back to a condition of vitality. As inexpensive as phals are my personal recommendation is to try another plant and this time walk through its care with us throughout - before you get to a point of despair. They are not that difficult once you get the hang of it - and will bring you lots of enjoyment.

[janet_a]

what mayres. said.

[brookn]

Hi, has this plant ever been repotted? The sphag in that pot is long soured, and if this is the original sphag that the plant came in, I am shocked that it has lasted this long. If indeed that is a new leaf (I cannot tell from the pic, can you get a clearer one?), and you truly are on board with saving it you will have to repot. Your description of the roots outward condition makes me suspect that the plant has rotted from the root up. I would not bother cutting the spike, let it bloom, but you probably need to repot if it is even possible to save the plant. You might get lucky and it will throw a keiki. It seems to me if it is indeed growing a leaf, that this is one tough plant, but it will be a couple years of recovery if it recovers at all. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but this is just a learning experience for everyone, next time around it will be better. Go get a new plant to console yourself, and we will all be happy to help you right from the beginning. And if you are truly wanting to save this one, we will be happy to advise you on what to do next. Also I have found that a plant in a plastic lined cachepot like that cannot get enough air to the roots making the mix even more stagnant.

[BunnytheOrchid]

Any green on the plant, whether in root form or in leaf form, can do some photosynthesis. However, having said that, leaves are the main source of getting energy for plant, so even if there is the possibility of a new leaf or some roots on the top, this is NOT nearly enough to sustain and support flower growth. As mayres said, don't focus on flowering the orchid if you would like it to survive. Put bluntly, it can't focus on that right now if it doesn't have any leaves. It needs the leaves first.

[brookn]

Well, okay. I had a reason for my recomendation, as I believe there is probably nothing left of the plant. I was recomending leaving the spike as I suspect it is probably going to throw a keiki, obviously I shouldn't have said a thing. To put it bluntly I obviously should have stayed out of this thread, I had no idea my comment would be provoking.

[Hummer344]

Looks like the plant should go to the compost bin.

[made4engineering]

Like Bunny said, I think your best bet is to cut the little spike off, and let the roots photosynthesize. There are many close relatives of Phalaenopsis (and even some members of that genus!) that never have any leaves, and use only their roots for gathering sun. So I personally would recommend that you expose any roots near the surface to sunlight

[PhalPal]

For me, the answer to any Phal problem is to check the roots first. No roots = No orchid. Take it out of the pot and see what you have brewing in that old spraghum. Your watering habits may have been fine for the plant a year ago but the moss may be holding more water as it gets older and ultimately rotting roots/crowns.

[patlee]

Sorry!! I've had a few phals get to that state, and whenever I pulled the plant from the pot, the roots were gone. (Even a little green leaf will not survive if there are no roots to give it nourishment.)

This is just what I have found. Yours may be different, but I doubt it...

[sandra]

Over time, Phals will naturally lose their bottom leaves, one at a time. They'll turn yellow and eventually fall off, it's nothing to be concerned about. However, seemingly, healthy leaf's that are green, should not be falling away from the plant. While people do have a lot of success with sphag., you really have to be familiar with this medium when using it, especially for Phals., so in order to know when to water. As well, over time it gets very heavy, retaining too much water and needs a re-fluffing to allow air to flow through this medium properly.

Why don't you get yourself another plant, they're quite inexpensive. There are many people on this board who will walk you through the steps in preparing it when you bring it home, from what medium to use, to how to water it (depending on the medium) and how often. Once you know the basics, you'll start becoming intuitive to the plant's needs and will be able to recognize when it's on the right track and...when it's not.

Don't give up! Ones best success comes after their greatest disappointments. I think we've only gotten better at this by knowing what we've done wrong in the past.

[lisadpa]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. I really appreciate them and the sharing of experience.

I am amazed to see that the new growth out of the crown is indeed the teeny beginnings of a leaf. I cannot believe how much it's grown even in one day! However, I do realize that this plant is probably history. I will buy a new plant just to have a happy blooming beauty in my window.

I will use what is left of the life of this plant as a learning experience. I will check out the roots, expose them, get rid of that spraghum...I will think about repotting (if I can get a small enough bag of medium, so far I have only seen huge ones). I think I'll dump the basket too. I won't cut the spike, since it's growing like crazy. I want to see what it will do, I think saving this plant is too difficult a task for a first timer and as you've all said it's probably better to start over. This time I will look for a plant with nice roots. This one was a gift from my husband and never had any decent roots from day one.

[PhalPal]

I have learned so much from the plants I have killed. It didn't take long for me to gain the confidence to know I could grow any Phal I purchased. Go out and buy a new beauty and give us a call; we'lll walk you through a good start.

FYI - here is a good link for basic culture on a lot of the most commonly grown orchids: AOS | Home

[lisadpa]

{{sigh}} there was not a single living root on that plant (or if there is, it is one and tiny and very sad-looking)

Someone said this must be one tough plant...I'm telling you, it must be because it is amazing that there is this crazy spike (must be two inches or more long by now and it only showed up about 3 weeks ago) and this amazing tiny leaf. It's amazing there is any sign of life left in this plant. Whatever energy it has must be in the stalk...

I dumped all the nasty sphagnum (there was a ton of it including a huge dense chunk of it buried) and just left the barky stuff...the roots (if you can call them that) and crown are in the light now...

I know it's hard to grow these at first, but I read everything when I first got the plant and tried so hard (didn't have the nerve to repot it though) and part of me wants to give up. I mean, I can purchase a new one for $30, have it bloom for 3 or 4 months and then plan to get another one next spring. I wanted to grow these...buy more, but I am afraid I might not even have the time. I'm having a baby around 5/10. When my daughter was born I didn't even have time to water my houseplants...I let a pothos die, isn't that horrible? Who kills a pothos????? If I didn't have time for a pothos, what makes me think I'll have time for an orchid!

Have you guys EVER heard so much self pitying drivel from an orchid newbie before??? LOL! I'm being so silly I'm actually cheering myself up.

Seriously though, I admire you guys tremendously and I am very grateful for your sage advice and all of the white sheets on this site...I love orchids so very much and you guys who are growing them are some of the nicest folks I've encountered on message boards. Thank you!

[Vivienne]

Lisa - don't give up! I would bet money that 95% of the OrchidGeeks have lost at least 1 plant. I know I have!!

There are a few things to take in to consideration. Most importantly is finding plants that YOU can take care of in YOUR conditions. And when reading about their care, it's important to remember that, the person/people who wrote the care instructions, do not live where you do. Growing orchids is easy once you find what works for YOU.

Now someone much wiser than I (could be anyone but I bet it was Kevin) made the best statement about this (finding what works for you). Sorry, I'm having an old-age moment.

But, don't give up! Time to go buy a new orchid!!!

[janet_a]

an orchid expert is defined in one of 2 ways: someone who has killed 1,000 plants, or someone who has killed their weight in plants.

we've all done it, and we'll all do it again. keep your plant if you want to experiment on it, but don't let this experience stop you from getting more. [/enable]