What is the name of this Phalaenopis?

[CindyLouWho]

Hi everyone,

I am new to the world of growing orchids, though I grow and have grown alot of plants over the years. I purchased my first trio of phals from the ever popular orchid source...Home Depot. Like so many of you, I just couldn't stop at one, though I had very good intentions . I have included a photo of all three. I believe the one in the foreground is venetian peach, the middle one Josephine, and the far one is...????. I have included two more photos of the unidentified one. It has two different colors of petals and brown stems. Also, if anyone thinks I have mis-identified the first two please let me know. Thus far, I have had a hard time finding a full online photo list of all the phals.

Thanks so much for your help and I am looking forward to learning all I can to make my orchids happy and productive!

Cindy

[rcb]

Just wanted to say welcome! And congrats on your first orchids!

[Irene]

Very pretty!

[maiseymoo]

Nice pics!
PS Welcome!

[syndywindy]

Hi, welcome to the forum. Unless your orchids came with identifying tags, you will probably never know. There are so many hybrid phal's out there it would be nearly impossible to identify them. But they really are quite lovely, so enjoy them.

[phalaephila]

Hi! And Welcome!

I went into my OrchidWiz program, and looked up all the Phalaenopsis listed (including species and Doritaenopsis hybrids), and came up with 28,794 registered plants. This does not include any hybrids that have been made, but not registered with its own name. With only 60+ phal species making up all these hybrids, you might imagine that some might come out looking very similar. Without a tag, it really is difficult to be sure of the identification.

But, to be honest, I have just put a name on one of my unidentified plants. I will always put a question mark after the name on the tag, however, even though it seems to match exactly! So call me a hypocrite....

Also, according to OrchidWiz and the Royal Horticultural Society website, I could not find a phal. registered as Josepine; there is Bon Josephine, Josephine Black, Josephine Knerr, Josephine Tierney, Memoria Josephine Erickson and Tammi Josephine. Where did you find your name?

In any case, your phals are lovely, and they are passion of mine. My favorite plant blooming right now is a noid (No Idendification). Thanks so much for sharing!

Jeanne

[CindyLouWho]

Yes, I would agree that I feel as though finding the name is like finding a needle in a haystack. Here's where I found the Josephine:

bockbioscience.com

click on products and then phalaenopis

I could not find Josephine anywhere else either, but the photo on the Brock site really is an excellant match. I wish the "JustAddIceOrchid.com" website, which is what many of the home depot orchids are tagged (at least here in MN) would post a list of those they grow for shipment.

BTW what is this whole just add 3 ice cubes once per week for healthy happy orchids that the Just Add Ice Company promotes? Does anyone out there actually do that as a sole means of watering as they suggest?

Thanks for looking on my behalf.

Cindy

[phalaephila]

To me, it looks like all the names on the Bock site are marketing names / brand names, not the true registered hybrid name - For example, "Mickey" looks like a white Phal. equestris. "Mr. Hyde" looks like one of the Dtps. I-Hsin Black Jack clones. Lots of pretty phals there, however.

As for "Just Add Ice" - another marketing ploy. I could not give my warmth-loving orchids the cold treatment, it's just not how they get watered in the wild. I feel bad giving them cool RO water from the tap!

Jeanne

[dounoharm]

the just add ice routine is a pure marketing ploy.....and unfortunately it is sucessful....lots of people out there looking for an easy way to keep plants.....orchids come from equatorial or temparate climates and dont respond well to ice being put on thier roots.....so just give it a good drink of unsoftened tap water when it dries out!

[orchidannie615]

Hi, I am new to this orchid forum also. I have found that many of the phalaenopsi sold at HomeDepot, etc. are grown in clear plastic pots. Stamped on the plastic pot is a number and sometimes a name. If your plastic pot has a number stamped on the side I maybe able to find out the hybrid name for you. Please look and then let me know.

[fred]

welcome to the forum Cindy
nice to have you with us

orchidannie615 please go to the introduction section of the forum and introduce yourself to the other 'geeks'

then you can enlighten us as to what makes you say you can put names of hybrids to those numbers

[CindyLouWho]

Hi,
I just checked all three and no numbers on the plastic pots, but as I mentioned 2 of the 3 I purchased are from the Just Add Ice company. What area of the US do you live in, perhaps your local Home Depots are using aomeone else as their supplier?

Cindy

[CindyLouWho]

Hi,

Yes, I totally agree about not having the heart to put cold or in this case frozen liquid on top of those amazing green roots. By amazing, I mean that the hue of the green is so interesting...I watched a number of online videos for care, transplanting, and so on and the good old fashioned hold them under the sink and let the water run generously through once per week appealed to my plant logic :-)

Cindy

[CindyLouWho]

Hi Jeanne,

Thank you for the clarification on the marketing or brand name versus the registered name. That makes sense to me now and explains why I was not able to find any other data online on this particular color combo. What exactly is your thought on what this Bock company does? Do they breed orchids for others and try too come up with new hybrids?

Is there a site or two that you would recommend as a good source for photos and registered names for phals?

Cindy

[mytwogirls]

Welcome! Glad you are with us. Beautiful orchids!

[Tarad]

Welcome to the forum! I am afraid it maybe impossible to ID that phal. Too many out there that look like it. So it's name will be NOID without a tag. Ice is not the way to water your phal. Tara

[kmarch]

Originally Posted by CindyLouWho

...bockbioscience.com...

Don't waste your time using this site as any kind of authority on orchids or orchid names. It's a classic example of how useless (even misleading) web info can be, depending on the source of course. I did a cursory, random search, using the RHS website. I didn't find a single name that I searched for. I'd venture a guess that none of the names on that site are valid, and worse yet, IMHO, they're misleading.

[>> Oh, oh, look out, he's got his soap box out and is fixin' to get up on it in a BIG way...<<]

One of the things I think is so great about orchids is that there's something for everyone. Do you just want a pretty flower to Ooo and Ah over? The hobby can offer you something. Do you want a hobby that gives you some interesting reading and an occasional excursion or two? The hobby can offer you something in that arena. Do you like growing things? The hobby can give you that. Or do you really want a serious hobby that you can really sink your teeth in and go really far with? The hobby can meet those needs too. I think this is one of the best things about the hobby. You can have 2 noid phals on your windowsill or you can be a globe-trotting taxonomist who makes his living researching, growing, and publishing on orchids, OR like a lot of us here on the forum (most of us?), you can be anywhere in between.

Now there's a down side to this fantastic characteristic of the hobby. Because there can be so much to know, and because some of it can only (or best) be obtained through experience (meaning that some of it can take a while to learn), it can take a while for a newer grower to learn enough to be able to recognize problems when they arise. Let me get very specific here. An experienced grower will look at the phals and names on bockbioscience.com and the red flags will go off. There's something odd about the names. They'll look up a few and see right away that there's a big problem, that none of the names are registered. In other words, they're all fake names.

Ok, so assuming that they're just made up names, why is that a problem? Well, first off, it's deceptive. If the folks at bockbioscience.com know their orchids, then they (should) know that slapping these non-names onto their orchids is the wrong thing to do. People who are new or have less experience with the hobby will not know that these names are wrong. They'll think they have a nice named orchid when in reality they do not. Named/registered crosses are often worth more than NOIDs. See the potential problem here? A NOID gets slapped with a fake name, the buyer doesn't know it's a fake name and pays much more for the orchid than it is worth, ending up with an expensive NOID on their hands.

NOTE: I wish to make it quite clear that it is not my intention in any way to suggest that nameless orchids are no good (we've seen dozens, maybe even hundreds of beautiful NOIDs here on the forum), that it's a bad thing to buy them (I have some - pretty much every person I know does too), or that they or the person growing them is in any way inferior. I do not believe that and do not wish to give that impression.

Back to the topic: Made up names like these also become a big problem if some of these plants manage to be awarded or if some of them are used in a breeding program. None of the offspring from these mis-named orchids can be registered and in many (most?) instances, the orchid could nto be shown or judged. Presumably the "red flags" I've mentioned above would go off in the heads of judges and breeders and they'd avoid these plants (though I'm not going to bet on it).

And of course, as we have seen in this instance, the misleading info on those pages has led someone to think they had a lead on the name of their NOID hybrid when in fact they didn't.

In summary, in my opinion (others may have a differing opinion), this kind of practice is misleading and dishonest, making it easier to mislead and cheat those not well acquainted with orchid names and how they work. In my opinion it harms the hobby.

[>> Ok, it looks like he's getting off his soap box now so it's probably safe to come out...<<]

[phalaephila]

As far as websites for photos of phals with registered names - I don't know of any one site that would have everything. I look at vendor websites such as Big Leaf Orchids, orchids.com, Orchids by Hausermann among many others that I feel are reliable. For registration information, you can check out the Royal Horticultural Society:

The International Orchid Register | Royal Horticultural Society

This site has all the registered orchids, but no photos. I have software, OrchidWiz, which is a database of registered orchids and has many photos. Hope this helps!

[mytwogirls]

kmarch: You are the MAN! Great post!!!!!!!!!! I aspire to be HALF as knowledgeable as you when it comes to orchids. Wow.

[Tarad]

My phals are NOIDS presently, but use to be IDS, then IDS with each others IDS, then NOIDS by my decision and I dont think they care...much and are happy. Tara

[dounoharm]

a noid is just as pretty as a named variety....and they are all beautiful!!! we keep them for thier beauty predominately anyway.....a rose is a rose is a rose, and by any other name would smell as sweet.....the bard.....names are hard to keep track of...i have several tags that have worn away and now they are simply noids.....still beautiful!!

[CindyLouWho]

[quote] If the folks at bockbioscience.com know their orchids, then they (should) know that slapping these non-names onto their orchids is the wrong thing to do. People who are new or have less experience with the hobby will not know that these names are wrong. They'll think they have a nice named orchid when in reality they do not.

I appreciate your response to the nature of the bock bioscience company! Heh, we all have our soap boxes and an obligation to stand on them when the occasion arises :-)

With the new info I gleened here on searching for registered names and reputable sites, I did some more digging around and I think my misnamed "Josephine" is perhaps really a phal called KV Beauty 613. The petal pattern matches very well, (yellow w/deep rose veins), but I would like to see/find additional and close up photos of the "throat". Can you help?

Nevertheless, after realizing that there are indeed so very many hybrids, I am content to label them NOID and love them anyway. :-)

Cindy

[kmarch]

[quote=CindyLouWho;195269]

I appreciate your response to the nature of the bock bioscience company!

Well, I wasn't really claiming to know the motives of those who run the company but regardless of the motives, the outcomes are the same. The names are not valid and can mislead anyone who doesn't notice that.

[quote=CindyLouWho;195269]

Heh, we all have our soap boxes and an obligation to stand on them when the occasion arises :-)

This is true, we do, and admittedly one of mine is anything which in my view harms our hobby or our hobbiests.

[quote=CindyLouWho;195269]

I think my misnamed "Josephine" is perhaps really a phal called KV Beauty 613. The petal pattern matches very well, (yellow w/deep rose veins), but I would like to see/find additional and close up photos of the "throat". Can you help?

If you do a search in the RHS database you'll find that "KV Beauty 613" is not an orchid name. Registered orchid names do not contain numerals.

Once a hybrid name is lost it is nearly impossible to ID it. It is even more impossible to ID it from pictures, and even more so form web pictures. With orchid hybrids one cross can produce offspring that look so different that you'd never guess they were the same cross. Also, and we especially see this with phals, many different crosses can look exactly alike.

As some have rightly stated above, a flower is no less beautiful because it doesn't have a name. We all enjoy our NOIDs, otherwise we wouldn't grow them.

[orchidannie615]

Originally Posted by fred

welcome to the forum Cindy
nice to have you with us

orchidannie615 please go to the introduction section of the forum and introduce yourself to the other 'geeks'

then you can enlighten us as to what makes you say you can put names of hybrids to those numbers

Hello Fred,
I am new to online blogging. You suggested that I go to the introduction section and introduce myself. I would be glad to, but I am unable to locate that section. May I tell you that I have been growing orchids since 1981. I only wished to share so of my experience with other orchid lovers but it seems that I started something that I am unable to complete. I don't even know if I should click on (Post Quick Reply) or (Go Advanced). Or many I should click on Quote Message in reply?

[Phalcycle]

I have an orchid that looks simular to ur white and marron one.
mine came with a tag, that said 'p. City girl'